whisky all grain

all about mashing and fermenting grains

Re: whisky all grain

Postby Peregian » Sat Jul 28, 2018 10:18 am

bluc wrote:But with whiskey enzyme activity is wanted to get as much alcohol out of it as possible..within reason but you may gain one or two points if enzyme remains active..

With beer generally people dont want a high alcohol content 4-5% so they work out how much they want then stop it where they want it...if you are getting really good effeciency and are happy with sg then yes stop enzymes. If you undershoot a touch like me the little bit extra helps.. :handgestures-thumbupleft:


The second mash is soaking, heated the strike waster to 72deg C and added the malt, had to give it a good stir to break up the dough balls, as the brew kettle is insulated turned off the power and will steep for 90 minutes before resetting the PID to 65deg C for a further 90 minutes with the pump on.. will mash out at 77deg C.

Just mixing things up a little to see if results change. Seems to be easier to change things around when only using 6kg of malt, less to stuff up..
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Re: whisky all grain

Postby EziTasting » Sat Jul 28, 2018 10:24 am

It does create a possibility for experimentation - flavour wise, anyway...

@bluc you are, of corse, on the money! But I can’t help but wonder how much influence this would have on an AG!?!? :think:

So now, I wish I had a small still for testing....
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Re: whisky all grain

Postby Peregian » Sat Jul 28, 2018 2:16 pm

In the fermenter and SG 1.060 @ 28.2deg C, so nothing changed too much.

Tomorrow will try just steeping grain with strike water temp at 72deg C when malt is added and leave for 2 hours. will only run the pump at the start to distribute the heat evenly.

Also will try M-1 and Bakers yeast in combination.
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Re: whisky all grain

Postby bluc » Sat Jul 28, 2018 2:21 pm

:clap:
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Re: whisky all grain

Postby coffe addict » Sat Jul 28, 2018 2:50 pm

I can't remember where but there's a graph floating around the forums that correlates mash temp with the types of sugar's that are created ie fermentables/unfermentables and for whisky 65c is the upper limit. I usually aim for 63 but I'd probably aim for 62 if I had rims system.
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Re: whisky all grain

Postby EziTasting » Sat Jul 28, 2018 4:25 pm

I thought it related that enzyme activity/denaturisation...?

As in Alpha-Amylase works on medium chain carbs and functions best @ 60-67 C; Beta-Amylase which works on large chain carbs works somewhere in the vicinity of 50/55-60C... or something like that...

Happy to be corrected, tho. Wouldn’t be th first time! :teasing-tease:
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Re: whisky all grain

Postby coffe addict » Sun Jul 29, 2018 3:00 pm

Yeah that's true also. What I was referring to was what sugars are created at different temps. The warmer the mash the more unfermentables are made which is why beer brewers largely mash higher as they want more unfermentable sugars for residual flavour.
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Re: whisky all grain

Postby Peregian » Sun Jul 29, 2018 3:25 pm

The story for mash 3......

After milling the grain decided to put the last of the grain in bucket and noticed extra so divided the leftovers to make two even grain weights for the last two mashes. This works out to just under 7kg per mash.
The strike water was up to 68deg C so rather than adding more water to compensate for the extra grain just went with the 21 liters.
Added grain and all mixed up well so put the pump on to distribute the heated strike water. Pump was on for about 3-4 minutes.
Mash temp came down to 64deg C
Turned off the electrics and let it stand for 2 hours and stirred every 1/2 hour, was easy to stir not too thick.
Raised malt pipe to top of kettle and left to drain.
When most of the wort had drained then sparged with 80deg C water. Think I over sparged as ended up with 24 liters in the fermenter, was aiming for about 22 liters.

The best part is the SG of 1.070 @ 29.9 deg C

The yeast for this ferment is 25grams M-1 and 25grams Bakers yeast.

I will try to replicate todays results tomorrow with the last of the grain.
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Re: whisky all grain

Postby Sam. » Sun Jul 29, 2018 5:29 pm

That’s a hot sparge temp, I would suspect you would have pulled some tannins out :-B
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Re: whisky all grain

Postby Peregian » Sun Jul 29, 2018 5:57 pm

Sam. wrote:That’s a hot sparge temp, I would suspect you would have pulled some tannins out :-B


Time will tell, I guess. Tasted OK lickin me fingers.

Tomorrow will lower the sparge temp and cut back on the total amount of sparge water.
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Re: whisky all grain

Postby coffe addict » Sun Jul 29, 2018 8:27 pm

@1070 there's no need to reduce your sparge water!
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Re: whisky all grain

Postby EziTasting » Mon Jul 30, 2018 8:07 am

:text-+1:
Was just thinking that... I try to aim for a min. of 1065 with a high of 1085 (if I get there)... :handgestures-thumbupleft:
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Re: whisky all grain

Postby coffe addict » Mon Jul 30, 2018 9:20 am

Yeah I aim 1065 to 1075 on base malt and if there's adjunct grain (lots of unfermentable sugars) as high as 1085. As I'm using ale yeast pushing it higher stresses them out too much
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Re: whisky all grain

Postby EziTasting » Mon Jul 30, 2018 12:34 pm

coffe addict wrote:....As I'm using ale yeast pushing it higher stresses them out too much


You got a favourite? Or still looking?
Had the chance to distill a batch of jondbrewers beer that smelled strongly like bananas... unfortunately I lost it in the stilling run... but that has more to do with how I ran it...
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Re: whisky all grain

Postby coffe addict » Mon Jul 30, 2018 2:26 pm

Currently using us05 but when I run out I might try a more traditional English ale yeast.
Us05 is a big improvement over safspirit malt yeast imo
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Re: whisky all grain

Postby bluc » Mon Jul 30, 2018 2:57 pm

coffe addict wrote:Currently using us05 but when I run out I might try a more traditional English ale yeast.
Us05 is a big improvement over safspirit malt yeast imo

Interesting :think: how is it better less fruity, dryer less sweet...? Just curious.
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Re: whisky all grain

Postby Peregian » Mon Jul 30, 2018 3:35 pm

Just finished he last of the 4 mashes and all seems good.

Today overshot the strike water temp with grain added by 3deg C, so for all of the rest ( 2 hours) the mash was at 65 - 66deg C but was trying for 63 - 64deg C .

Did the sparge at 75 -76deg C and ended with 23 liters in the fermenter at SG 1.070 @ 28deg C.

Have been very pleased with the final two mash results so will stick with the 2 hour soak method over running the pump. When the pump is run continuously the wort gets a thick foam on top like a good beer, the wort will go almost crystal clear as it filters through the grain bed.

Would like to know the advantages of soak or continuous recirculating.
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Re: whisky all grain

Postby coffe addict » Mon Jul 30, 2018 4:31 pm

I've found the us05 to be more fruity and complex. The safspirit was quite one dimensional but lots of malt flavour.
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Re: whisky all grain

Postby bluc » Mon Jul 30, 2018 4:42 pm

coffe addict wrote:I've found the us05 to be more fruity and complex. The safspirit was quite one dimensional but lots of malt flavour.

Ok cool. Perigian that's interesting I would think pump circulating would increase efficiency and provide a more stable temp. Do you use a rims or hermes? Or did you just circulate with no heat source? :-B Maybe only on a thicker mash circulating helps..
Last edited by bluc on Mon Jul 30, 2018 4:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: whisky all grain

Postby Peregian » Mon Jul 30, 2018 5:39 pm

bluc wrote: Perigian that's interesting I would think pump circulating would increase efficiency and provide a more stable temp. Do you use a rims or hermes? Or did you just circulate with no heat source? :-B Maybe only on a thicker mash circulating helps..


I thought pumping/circulating would be good for efficiency but 2 x circulating then 2 x soaking (with a stir every 1/2 hour) has shown better efficiency. Just thought the wort going round & round was good, well it did look good.
I use a GUTEN brew kettle, it is similar to a Grain Father or Robo Brew, but more squat (wider). It has had all the electrics removed and replaced with a Auber PID and SSR, this is a step mashing pid and works well. The temp probe is placed in the center of the mash for a more accurate reading. The PID can be set up to do stem mashing (it will go to a set temp and hold for X minutes before going to the next temp setting and hold for x minutes, it will do ths 8 times in all.
When I did circulate on the first 2 mashes the pid was in control and maintained the temperature at 65deg C.
When I did the soak mashes the element abd pump were turned off.
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