Punching down the Grain Cap

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Punching down the Grain Cap

Postby Tuner » Mon Dec 18, 2017 3:06 pm

I asked this on another forum - Punching down the Grain Cap
All Grain - fermentation on the grain. The last one, ferment on grain got very infected. So I'm concerned about the grain Cap:
- could this harbour bad "Bugs"
- So do you punch down the Grain Cap?
- If so how often?
- Do you remove the Grain Cap off the ferment?
- Will the excess of CO2 held down on the fermentation by the Grain Cap " poison the yeast " ( did I read that somewhere)?

Grain Bill
48 lbs - Corn - Milled to a flour with the Kitchen Aid Grinder
8 lbs - @ Row Malt Crushed with gap of .035"
8 lbs - @ Munich Malt Crushed with gap of .035"
2 TBSP -Critic Acid
2 TBSP - Epson Salts
16 US GAL H20
1 TBSP SEBamyl GL Enzymes
1 TBSP SEBflo TL Enzymes
PH: 5.4 SG:1.058
3 - packets Saflager S-23 - with Great Yeast Starter - bubbling CO2 very hard in 6 hours

Cooking:
- Cooked the corn for 3 hours at 185 deg F with 11 gals H2O
- put hot corn mash into a 100 qt cooler let is stay till temp was 150 deg F
- Added Malts plus enzymes for 3 hours rest temp down to 140 Deg F.
- Put in Primary fermenter topped up with cold water
- Chilled with copper coil to 70 Deg F.
- inoculated wort with the yeast.
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Re: Punching down the Grain Cap

Postby tipsy » Mon Dec 18, 2017 3:49 pm

I never do...unless it's trying to climb out of the fermenter.

I've also never fermented on the grain.....I'm sure you would have to have a lacto infection doing so...but that might not be a bad thing :think:
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Re: Punching down the Grain Cap

Postby tipsy » Mon Dec 18, 2017 3:51 pm

Tuner wrote:- Will the excess of CO2 held down on the fermentation by the Grain Cap " poison the yeast " ( did I read that somewhere)?


I've never heard of that before...sounds very dubious. The yeast turn anaerobic anyway.
Last edited by tipsy on Mon Dec 18, 2017 3:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Punching down the Grain Cap

Postby Tuner » Mon Dec 18, 2017 3:52 pm

Just Punched it down
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Re: Punching down the Grain Cap

Postby bluc » Mon Dec 18, 2017 5:21 pm

Nah co2 wont poison the yeast. Personally have never knocked down the grain cap.

Lacto and other bacterias are present on the grain itself so when fermenting on the grain unlesd you boil the mix before pitching yeast then good chance of infection.
Idea is get it cool fast after mashing and pitch a good healty yeast starter that will outpreform the bacteria and give you a good fermentation. If bacteria gets solid hold first it is harder for the yeast to work..
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Re: Punching down the Grain Cap

Postby bluc » Mon Dec 18, 2017 6:22 pm

Do you ferment in sealed or open container :-B
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Re: Punching down the Grain Cap

Postby Tuner » Mon Dec 18, 2017 10:07 pm

bluc wrote:Do you ferment in sealed or open container :-B

Open with a lid
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Re: Punching down the Grain Cap

Postby Shine time » Thu Mar 01, 2018 10:57 pm

Personally I have trouble fermenting on the grain so I strain it out with the help of a poly tank lid with the stainless mesh it’s all hard yards with corn it blocks everything it touches . The grain cap is exsposed to air allowing the lacto that is naturally on corn to run wild and simply multiply 5 fold faster than yeast which will smell bad and taint the whole wort this is a typical lacto infection runaway which will need to be heated up to 80 plus deg to stop it. Then re pitch your yeast starter to get the upper hand on the lacto , try to cover the fermenter at the start to reduce air and wild yeast coming into contact with the wort once it,s bubbling away then you can open to check on progress , lacto imparts a unique flavour in the mash which is a winner so keep going your on track
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Re: Punching down the Grain Cap

Postby Aussiedownunder01 » Fri Mar 02, 2018 6:18 am

Never do up to 11 th Generation uncle j now
Last edited by Aussiedownunder01 on Fri Mar 02, 2018 6:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Punching down the Grain Cap

Postby wynnum1 » Fri Mar 02, 2018 6:50 am

Your enzymes are both low temperature if you look at one the 150deg F is over temperature can you get a high temperature enzyme can also put a portion of the malt in at a higher temperature
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Re: Punching down the Grain Cap

Postby coffe addict » Fri Mar 02, 2018 8:16 am

I think you're over complicating a bit. You shouldn't need to add citric and with that amount of malt you also shouldn't need to add enzymes.
If you add half the malt at 70c and the rest at 65c you'll get pretty good conversion.
Lacto is on grain naturally and is usually viewed as beneficial in a bourbon style whisky.
It may sound basic but make sure you clean your hands very thoroughly as I think they are usually the source of most infections. As the side of a moderately washed fermenter isn't conducive to the growth of most bacteria in comparison to our warm sweaty hands.
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Re: Punching down the Grain Cap

Postby scythe » Sat Mar 03, 2018 6:53 am

Funny you mention hands being gross:

Image
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Re: Punching down the Grain Cap

Postby Plumby » Sat Mar 03, 2018 8:08 am

scythe wrote:Funny you mention hands being gross:

Image

:puke-huge: :puke-huge: :puke-huge:
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