Enzymes for all grain washes

all about mashing and fermenting grains

Re: Enzymes for all grain washes

Postby Urrazeb » Sat Dec 27, 2014 9:56 pm

Anyone tried this stuff? :shifty: :think:


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Re: Enzymes for all grain washes

Postby TheMechwarrior » Sat Dec 27, 2014 10:07 pm

Nope, sounds familiar...same stuff used for Shōchū?
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Re: Enzymes for all grain washes

Postby Urrazeb » Sun Dec 28, 2014 10:45 am

Yeah it's the enzyme included gear for non malt mashing, pretty much means you can convert anything really
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Re: Enzymes for all grain washes

Postby OzKev » Sun Dec 28, 2014 11:05 am

I use this stuff from that supplier for converting high levels of adjuncts. Works a treat and will last me a long time. A lot cheaper than buying it per 4g bags.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Amylase-Enzyme- ... 5b07737e9c
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Re: Enzymes for all grain washes

Postby AussieDistiller1989 » Fri Jan 16, 2015 10:10 pm

also found this the other night looking for Enzymes havnt used it or other Enzymes before http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/231263273945 ... EBIDX%3AIT

or has anyone every tried using digestive aid tablets they contain a few different types of Enzymes
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Re: Enzymes for all grain washes

Postby OzKev » Sat Jan 17, 2015 2:10 pm

It would be good if you ferment on the grain. :handgestures-thumbupleft:
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Re: Enzymes for all grain washes

Postby aussiemoonshiner » Sat Jun 13, 2015 4:53 pm

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Re: Enzymes for all grain washes

Postby aussiemoonshiner » Sat Jun 13, 2015 4:55 pm

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Re: Enzymes for all grain washes

Postby Moonshine Millar » Sat Feb 27, 2016 8:41 pm

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Re: Enzymes for all grain washes

Postby stevefzr » Wed Jan 11, 2017 11:11 am

Hi Folks,

I just ordered the enzyme kit from Artisan resources LLC using that enzymash link. US$60 for the 16oz kit, plus US$30 post. Best thing is they ship USPS 1st class, which is the most likely way for it to get through customs without being stopped. I asked them to include the MSDS when they ship. I'll report back on how they work once they arrive. Their site includes a really clear "how to mash" guide https://enzymash.biz/index.php?route=in ... ation_id=9

Question: can I extend the life of these by freezing them?

Regards,

Steve C
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Re: Enzymes for all grain washes

Postby warramungas » Wed Jan 11, 2017 12:10 pm

Preferably not. Enzymes dont like it when in liquid form (ice crystals are not good for them). You can refrigerate though.
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Re: Enzymes for all grain washes

Postby OzzyChef » Wed Jan 11, 2017 1:47 pm

What about these? Anyone have any input or experience with them? I must assume they are similar to the Ss enzymes?

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/182330361961
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Re: Enzymes for all grain washes

Postby bluc » Wed Jan 11, 2017 1:58 pm

Urrazeb wrote:Yeah it's the enzyme included gear for non malt mashing, pretty much means you can convert anything really

How do you mash non malted i wouldnt think there would be much starch to convert :geek:
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Re: Enzymes for all grain washes

Postby wynnum1 » Wed Jan 11, 2017 2:02 pm

Amylase enzyme will only get you part of the way to conversion .
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Re: Enzymes for all grain washes

Postby OzzyChef » Wed Jan 11, 2017 3:21 pm

wynnum1 wrote:Amylase enzyme will only get you part of the way to conversion .


Can you elaborate? I understand that alpha mbreakdcthe chains down in size so that beta can then convert. What do you mean? I'm keen to learn as much as possible on my journey to AG
Cheers
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Re: Enzymes for all grain washes

Postby wynnum1 » Thu Jan 12, 2017 9:17 am

If you look at the enzyme manufacture information
Breaks 1,4 linkage in starch during liquefication, producing dextrin and a small amout of maltose.
These do not ferment out to alcohol you want glucose
Leaves 1,6 links,
GLUCOAMYLASE AMYLASE ENZYME is what you need to finish off .
The enzymes chop up the starch into smaller compounds and to get full fermentation need to get to the smallest compound if you put these enzymes into beer would end up with alcohol and little flavor.
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Re: Enzymes for all grain washes

Postby EziTasting » Sat Jan 14, 2017 11:34 am

Interesting discussion.

My limited understanding let me believe that Beta-Amylase would need to digest (convert) the starches first in order for Alpha-Amylase to be able to finish the conversion at its most efficient. The reason why HBS tend to only sell the Alpha-amylase is because of the flavour aspect mentioned above.

How good/close is my understanding to the truth?
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Re: Enzymes for all grain washes

Postby OzzyChef » Sun Jan 22, 2017 10:50 pm

EziTasting wrote:Interesting discussion.

My limited understanding let me believe that Beta-Amylase would need to digest (convert) the starches first in order for Alpha-Amylase to be able to finish the conversion at its most efficient. The reason why HBS tend to only sell the Alpha-amylase is because of the flavour aspect mentioned above.

How good/close is my understanding to the truth?


Close enough Eli, the beta liquified the starch or "dextrize's" it then the alpha converts it. No idea why HBS sell what they sell, I'm sure there is a thread somewhere explaining that ... :))
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Re: Enzymes for all grain washes

Postby wynnum1 » Mon Jan 23, 2017 4:57 am

This is from a bio fuel web site and gives a good summary
Steps in the Grain Ethanol Manufacturing Process
Milling
The sorghum, corn or wheat first passes through hammer mills, that grind it into a fine powder called meal.
Liquefaction
The meal is then mixed with water and alpha-amylase, goes through cookers, and starch is liquefied at higher temperatures. These high temperatures reduce bacteria levels in the mash.
Saccharification
The mash is then cooled and the secondary enzyme (gluco-amylase) added to convert the liquefied starch to fermentable sugars.
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Re: Enzymes for all grain washes

Postby Urrazeb » Wed Feb 22, 2017 12:47 am

bluc wrote:
Urrazeb wrote:Yeah it's the enzyme included gear for non malt mashing, pretty much means you can convert anything really

How do you mash non malted i wouldnt think there would be much starch to convert :geek:

All grain has starch mate, malted grain contains the enzymes in natural form to convert the starch (locked away) contained in that grain to sugar to feed the new shoot (plant) due to the grain being started under specific conditions and then forced to cease by drying or kilning.

When the malting (sprouting) occurs, smaller carbohydrates, amino acids and lipids are produced, and open up the seed's starch reserves. This is known as modification. The amount of enzymatic starch conversion potential that a malt has is referred to as its diastatic power or DP. This can be analysed in a lab and given a rating in Degrees Linter, you want to make sure any mash you are making is sitting at 70 degrees linter or above for full conversion of all available starches. The kiln drying of the new malt denatures a lot of the different enzymes, but several types remain, including the ones necessary for starch conversion and mainly this is the Alpha and Beta Amylase that we want.

Aside from getting into kilning temps and the many variations associated with producing malted grain the reason is basically for the enzymes, as well as the obvious flavour profile different malts bring to the table.

Isolated enzymes take a lot of the guess work out of malt that has not been analysed for DP.

When using malt, the DP of that malt should be known so as to ensure the ratio of malt to unmalted grain is optimised. Although certain malts hold a predisposition to a certain amount of enzyme, there are just too many factors involved in malting to be sure you have what the grain has intended without lab testing the malt for actual DP.
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