Aussiedistiller, Home Distilling, Moonshine, Home Brew

Sorry for all the questions...
I’ve been running a Reflux (T500) and pot still for over a year now.
Usually use a TPW.
1x pot
2 x reflux
1 x carbon filter.
I toss the fores.
I believe I cut it successfully but maybe I’m cocking this up.

I make clear spirit and then pot run for vapour infusion for gin. I don’t use any pith from the citrus.

I’ve tried dozens of different tweeks. Yet, there is still this mildly bitter aftertaste that coats the back of your mouth after sipping. You can sometimes taste it an hour afterwards. Ruins the otherwise pleasant drink.

:wtf:

Any thoughts as to what is causing this? Is it because I’m using the T500 and that’s as good as it gets?

Help :o

You should post your botanical's list to see if anybody can help identify the culprit

What packing in your reflux?

Plus how do you run your t500?

Thanks.

I follow blonde.chaps gin receipe verbatim. viewtopic.php?f=32&t=3447
I’ve tried others too.

50degrees
Packed with stainless and copper saddles. Cleaned regularly.
Run it per the other post here. Never over late 50’s chasing the tails.
I suspect it’s to do with making the alcohol, not the gin. As that same flavour carries through.
Where should I be looking? Is that aftertaste unusual for a t5 or is that normal?

I have not run a T500 but I would think you could check by a process of elimination. To me heads taste "twangy" but I don't get an after taste for a long time later. If it is a specific taste you can identify, can you taste it in the alembic pot still strip as the packing does not come in to use yet? Can you taste it after the first and/or second reflux run? Can you taste it in you hearts? When you have your cuts jars and are assessing, do you notice it at different levels in heads and tails? Do you notice a change after carbon filtering? How does it compare to commercial vodka? If your neutral is OK then have some of your botanicals gone off? Maybe something has gone rancid or mouldy. Try macerations of each and see if you can pick anything up. Gin makers do macerations of each batch of ingredients individually to ensure a consistent product. Hope this helps. Good luck.
Peter C.

1 more question.
What is your take off rate?
Too fast and you will smear heads and tails through the whole run, no matter how many times you re-run it.

Great comments thanks.
Take off rate - usually the dribble and drip but let me check. Sometimes it’s a bit faster than that at the start.
Peter - your process of elimination is logical. I have it before and it appears to be there from the first run however it’s a lot harder to pick (even when diluted down).

Perhaps try a wbab instead of the tpw, wbab makes a great neutral

:text-+1:
I use tpw as a reference point when trying new equipment out as it's very consistent and it's what I started with but it requires alot of refluxing to get it neutral and remove the twangy tomato wine taste. There's lots of easier washes to get to neutral and some like wbab don't even need to be neutral as a slight grain flavour is often desirable.
Leaving tpw for a cpl months to settle out is usually helpful but who has the patience for that?

I would try to eliminate your spirit base before looking at the gin recipe. Do you have any of the neutral you used left over? If so, dilute it down to %40 and have a taste to see if you can detect it. If there's an off flavour in your base, it will quite possibly come though in your gin too.

Cheers,
Prof. Green.

Run some Plain water through it to see if the taste is in the still
I'm just fermenting my first wbab as I was not liking the aftertaste either
My still has a low purity output, I ran the last of my tpw at 30% instead of the usual 40% ( i strip at an average of 70%, spirit run average 80%) it was much less noticeable, best tasting I've managed so far

Awesome feedback. How did people work this stuff out pre-forums???

So another run tonight. I’m fairly confident that the twangy taste is also in the neutral pre-gin botanicals thanks Peter & prof G. :animals-chickencatch:
How do I then eliminate the taste from the spirit base? Do I micro cut at 100mls? Tasting the forshots (carefully) and the heads, it does taste like this is the flavour that’s coming through to the end.

To ensure I’m not been too stingy on the cuts, For a 50L TPW, what sort of yield should I expect after two or three runs? 3 litres?

Can’t edit my post -
I’m still trying to work out if this is as good as it gets for the T5. Do I bin it and buy a bubble plate thingy? Will I look back and say what a waste of a life it was trying to hot rod and tweak the T5?

You should expect roughly 4.5L at 95.6% ABV total from a 50L 10%ABV wash.
All of that 4.5L wont be drinkable though, how much you are left with after cuts is up to you but i would think about 3L or a little less is about right.
You can do 100mL cuts if you have enough jars but most would do 250mL-300mL once they get to know the wash and their still.

Never taste fores
Would you taste petrol? Because doing that is "safer" than tasting fores.

When did the twang start, from day 1 or only recently?
How long does a spirit run take for you to do?

Rolls, i agree with Coffee Addict... i have had similar 'off' flavs with the TPW... Quickest and Easiest fix is to use a different wash. I personally prefer Kale as it is quite a clean neutral and very reliable in terms of outcome, so have not bothered with others as it does the trick for me. TPW can be a bit hard to remove all the aftertaste, so i found, even with a triple distill going super slow. I could not work out what i was doing wrong as the neutral was not that neutral, ditched it...problem solved.

Thanks. It usually takes 6 hours or so. Nice and slow.
I checked and the taste is there in the alcohol so at least I know it’s not the gin processing. It’s almost as if the heads run through the entire run, just with variations of intensity.
Kale - happy to try anything....I’ve invested so much time and extra ten hours or so won’t make that much difference. :sad:
I’m in inner Melbourne, Australia. Is there anyone that would be happy to taste my alcohol to confirm that it’s stuffed and I need to turn my attention to knitting instead?

Does the kale wash produce the purest tasting neutral?

Is your still tuned correctly? :O)

On the weekend I got chatting to Dr Riggs the DōTERRA chief medical officer and part of the DōTERRA scientific Advisory Board, I had a lot of questions about using essential oils in the flavouring of alcohol for consumption but that’s a whole different post. Dr Riggs was telling me citrus oils when distilled, the heat breaks the oils down making several compounds, that’s why they extract citrus oils through cold press methods and not heat distillation. If the twangy taste is not the still or wash, it may be the heat interacting with some of the more delicate botanicals creating the off taste. But start simple and only make one change at a time so you can track & work out the cause so we can learn from your situation. Good luck mate, I’ll be watching with interest.

Kenster and Coffee Addict might have a point, TPW is maybe not the most neutral of spirits. Look on the Tried & Proven WBAB discussion thread, many there mention this as superior to TPW. Similar for the FFV. I have actually done some ferments with SS distillers yeast and sugar and got a much cleaner result than TPW. I had high temperatures in my shed here in Perth. The normal range for this yeast is 22 - 26C but I had 30C. I did get a faint fruity banana like note perhaps because of the high temperature which was not off putting and not noticed once flavoured or oaked. Good luck this is great hobby.
Peter C.