University ultrasonic aging study reduces years to days

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University ultrasonic aging study reduces years to days

Postby Bedlore » Sun Feb 05, 2017 9:14 pm

This one may be worth keeping an eye on. I've not read in full detail yet but their set-up appears to be replicable by a home enthusiast I think and doesn't require the cost of barrel.

http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/d-brief/2017/02/03/ultrasound-waves-wine-brandy/#.WJUL7RsrIgp
Study link http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1350417716304187
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Re: University ultrasonic aging study reduces years to days

Postby OzzyChef » Sun Feb 05, 2017 9:30 pm

Very interesting read. Doc once told me to give sous vide aging a try and once I have enough (high quality age worthy) product on hand I will
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Re: University ultrasonic aging study reduces years to days

Postby bluc » Tue Feb 07, 2017 6:56 pm

Hey ozzy is sous vide ageing where you put it in a sealed bag in a water bath? Just wondering what you could replace the plastic bag with?
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Re: University ultrasonic aging study reduces years to days

Postby scythe » Wed Feb 08, 2017 5:10 am

A glass jar?
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Re: University ultrasonic aging study reduces years to days

Postby OzzyChef » Wed Feb 08, 2017 6:08 am

bluc wrote:Hey ozzy is sous vide ageing where you put it in a sealed bag in a water bath? Just wondering what you could replace the plastic bag with?


That's correct bluc. And Scythe a glass jar would work totally. There could be an issue with how much vacuum you might be able to use due to the fragile nature of glass but I'm sure it could still work. I'll attempt it with some neutral next week as I don't want to waste anything better on experiments
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Re: University ultrasonic aging study reduces years to days

Postby the Doctor » Thu Feb 09, 2017 6:20 am

OzzyChef wrote:
bluc wrote:Hey ozzy is sous vide ageing where you put it in a sealed bag in a water bath? Just wondering what you could replace the plastic bag with?


That's correct bluc. And Scythe a glass jar would work totally. There could be an issue with how much vacuum you might be able to use due to the fragile nature of glass but I'm sure it could still work. I'll attempt it with some neutral next week as I don't want to waste anything better on experiments

Guys we use mason jars for experiments...they can take the vacuum and easy to use caps fit over the jars to connect them to a household vacuum pump... we are using ultrasonics for cocktails ...for things like rose petal martini's ...you can do a rose extraction in about 90 seconds at 64 degrees 4 mhz ultrasonic... Cleveland whiskey have been using Ultrasonics for some years to speed up ageing.
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Re: University ultrasonic aging study reduces years to days

Postby OzzyChef » Thu Feb 09, 2017 6:48 am

the Doctor wrote:
OzzyChef wrote:
bluc wrote:Hey ozzy is sous vide ageing where you put it in a sealed bag in a water bath? Just wondering what you could replace the plastic bag with?


That's correct bluc. And Scythe a glass jar would work totally. There could be an issue with how much vacuum you might be able to use due to the fragile nature of glass but I'm sure it could still work. I'll attempt it with some neutral next week as I don't want to waste anything better on experiments

Guys we use mason jars for experiments...they can take the vacuum and easy to use caps fit over the jars to connect them to a household vacuum pump... we are using ultrasonics for cocktails ...for things like rose petal martini's ...you can do a rose extraction in about 90 seconds at 64 degrees 4 mhz ultrasonic... Cleveland whiskey have been using Ultrasonics for some years to speed up ageing.
Doc


Thanks doc I'll be doing some sous vide/ cryovac experiments shortly
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Re: University ultrasonic aging study reduces years to days

Postby Bedlore » Thu Feb 09, 2017 11:57 am

the Doctor wrote:we are using ultrasonics for cocktails ...for things like rose petal martini's ...you can do a rose extraction in about 90 seconds at 64 degrees 4 mhz ultrasonic... Cleveland whiskey have been using Ultrasonics for some years to speed up ageing.
Doc


Hi Doc, is there threads/information on this anywhere? I note the study only used 5gram chips per Litre which I thought was amazing.
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Re: University ultrasonic aging study reduces years to days

Postby the Doctor » Thu Feb 09, 2017 2:03 pm

there is not a lot of information out there...we learn't all we know by good old experimentation.
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Re: University ultrasonic aging study reduces years to days

Postby baznkez » Thu Oct 05, 2017 12:21 pm

Hi ,
What % of spirit on oak do you apply US & temps
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Re: University ultrasonic aging study reduces years to days

Postby the Doctor » Thu Oct 05, 2017 12:30 pm

baznkez wrote:Hi ,
What % of spirit on oak do you apply US & temps

cask strength and 60 degrees Celsius is our usual starting point for experiments... our ultrasound is 47 megahertzfrom memory.
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Re: University ultrasonic aging study reduces years to days

Postby baznkez » Thu Oct 05, 2017 12:34 pm

Hi ,
What is cask strength ? most people age @ 65% on oak naturally from what i have read ? but not to sure whats safe using US
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Re: University ultrasonic aging study reduces years to days

Postby bluc » Thu Oct 05, 2017 1:33 pm

US proof is double abv. Cask strength generally is abv/proof that it comes out of the oak barrel. Not sure about what was meant by cask strength though and also dont know if 65% in ultrasonic bath is safe :-B
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Re: University ultrasonic aging study reduces years to days

Postby woodduck » Thu Oct 05, 2017 5:35 pm

Found this, might help
Sounds like it is the abv after it’s matured in a barrel :handgestures-thumbupleft:

http://www.mensjournal.com/food-drink/d ... y-20150420
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Re: University ultrasonic aging study reduces years to days

Postby Peregian » Thu Oct 05, 2017 7:17 pm

I put my spirits in a 2 liter Mason jar add the oak, pull a vacuum on the jar, then place the jar in the the garage window and let the heat of the sun work it's magic.
Jar gets very warm during the day and cool at night, works well for me.
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Re: University ultrasonic aging study reduces years to days

Postby db1979 » Thu Oct 05, 2017 9:00 pm

bluc wrote:and also dont know if 65% in ultrasonic bath is safe :-B

A lab I worked in used ultrasonic baths to degas large volumes of liquid solutions, often composed of water with large percentages of other solvents (acetonitrile, ethanol, methanol plus others). Never tried to ignite them but I bet many of these solutions would have been flammable. Never had any problems. Some of the solutions we degassed had no water in them and were 100% flammable solvents.
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Re: University ultrasonic aging study reduces years to days

Postby EziTasting » Fri Oct 06, 2017 8:32 am

Peregian wrote:I put my spirits in a 2 liter Mason jar add the oak, pull a vacuum on the jar, then place the jar in the the garage window and let the heat of the sun work it's magic.
Jar gets very warm during the day and cool at night, works well for me.



I do something similar using our carport (minus the vacuum - I don't have that capacity). Our outside temps are warming up again but night-time temps are still in the mid 20s so its a nice contrast to the 35-40 degree day time temps...

Don't have the capacity to do Ultrasound at this stage either, not totally sure I want to go down that path at this point... but that may change.
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Re: University ultrasonic aging study reduces years to days

Postby ThePaterPiper » Fri Nov 17, 2017 7:01 pm

Sorry to dig up an older thread, but this has peaked my interest. How much of a vacuum are we talking about here? Just wondering if say a corny keg would evacuate enough, even though they are designed to contain pressure. I could then leave it outside out of the sun to heat and cool.
Also, are ultrasonic frequencies transmissible through stainless?
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Re: University ultrasonic aging study reduces years to days

Postby db1979 » Fri Nov 17, 2017 8:02 pm

Sound passes through all matter. If it's not an acoustic insulator then it's all good. In a lab I used to work in we had large ultrasonic baths that were lined with stainless.
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Re: University ultrasonic aging study reduces years to days

Postby Mr Tinker » Fri Nov 17, 2017 8:13 pm

Yeah ThePat,
Ultrasonic baths are generally stainless containers with transducers on the outside. So the sound waves are already having to travel through stainless, they also travel very well through glass.
I use an ultrasonic bath for virtually all my aging. I put a demi in and fill the bath up around it.
I zap it an hour a day, for a week and then rest for a week or 2. All this is done with the Demi only covered tightly with muslin cloth.
Yes, you will loose some product with it covered this way, but that is as they say... the 'Angels Share'

This really does work, despite what many say.
Not sure it works as well as years of natural aging, but I guess I'll find out as the years slowly pass.

Cheers
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