Royal Oak

[crow]

ok I've been researching all I can on english oak , seems to me Its not used commercially in barrel construction anymore due to it being commercially unavailable .There are just not enough left of it . here's the thing , starting around 150 yrs ago the English acclimatization society decided to plant all the expended gold fields around here with royal oak . There is miles of it , It seems to me until around 150+ yrs ago this oak was held in high regard and falling out of favor due to its rarity more than anything else . Can anyone see why I don't experiment with this local stuff mean its everywhere here , I see it chopped as firewood from quite large old trees

[SBB]

Cant see why not provided you are 100% sure its is the RIGHT oak
Better still get some milled up and get a barrel made.

[crow]

yeah but .... , think I might Thoroughly test before whizzing it to SA for the coopers :-P

[Frank]

Mate, if its a winner then :clap: :dance: etc and I'll hope it is.

First things first though...IMHO, find/grab its botanical name and get a bit of (hopefully free) advice from the nearest State capital herbarium (sorry not too sure what yours would be, perhaps http://www.cpbr.gov.au/cpbr/.??) about ensuring its 'foodgrade'.

Once the toxicology is taken care of then :handgestures-thumbupleft: find that decent cooper for advice re source timber drying/aging/harvesting etc.
Good luck mate and I (for one) will look forward to how it goes.

[crow]

yes thanks Frank not far from here is the Australian forestry campus a branch of the university of melbuorne and the nursery and aust native seed bank near here is connected to them . the predecessors of them planted all the oak and pine here so they should be in the know . might have to take a stroll down there for a chat :-D . Hope ppl reading this realize I'm NOT referring to the eucalyptus know as Tassie oak or Vic ash . The Only native wood I would like to see a a discussion on is Santalum but I'll leave that for another thread down the track a bit

[crow]

Royal or English oak is almost certainly the oak growing here as it is by far the most common oak in Australia . its scientific name is Quercus robur it was planted extensively in France in the Napoleonic period known as Limousin oak it makes up much of the market of french oak . I've spent many hrs researching this and closely looking at the leaves acorns and bark and am almost totally convinced that all these trees here are in fact Q. robur ,reckon I'm good to go :-D I'll see if i can find one that looks like its been dead for yrs

[R-sole]

Usually lumber is cut green and air dried.

[crow]

oh.... :sad: that'll take ages
EDIT unless , we had flood after flood last yr and some big old trees fell across an access road down in the oldest plantation just behind the seed bank they cut them and dragged them off the track they might and only might still be there . Just need some small bit for testing

[dogbreath vodka]

Hey Croweater
5Star is right, lumber is usually rough sawn green in the largest lengths and the thicknesses most useful.
Most I say when working for a timber yard was 50mm thick or thicker and in varying lengths..... though that was NG Rosewood.

It gets stacked flat with small seperating sticks about 20mm sq between layers.
Then strapped to hold it together and minimise bowing.
The ends are painted with a water soluble oil/grease to stop splitting
Kept under cover IE in a shed or similar.That is called air drying.
After a year or longer it should be ready to use.

Maybe that depends on the variety of timber as to how it is dried.
Some I am told are kiln dried but if you are going to use it for barrels I'm not sure it would be a good idea.
Just a thought.

Love the idea of using local grown oak to make barrels.
Takes the home distilling thing to a whole new level. :handgestures-thumbupleft:

DBV

[crow]

Yeah I know getting ahead of myself a bit really I just need some pieces from a decent sized tree ATM just to see what sort of flavors this local gears going to impart . I started some Experiments 20+ yrs ago with alternative wood flavoring with my uncles brandy but never really saw it through , silly as it showed some real promise

[devotus]

you could still cut chunks off and air dry them which would dry a lot quicker and use them as oak sticks, not as good as a barrel but better than a poke in the eye.

[crow]

yes that's the plan maybe stick some in the oven chuck some in the fire(made of the same of cause) just play around and see if any of it works in regard to improving taste

[crow]

I've done some more investigation in to this and turn out I was dead right . It is all Quercus Robur (Royal oak, English oak , or limousine french oak ) so I went for a drive in the woods with the kids today , had no saw with but did get to grab some shattered pieces from fallen trees including one with a brass plate nailed to it reading planted1868 Quercus Robur . Anyway one piece is heartwood right from the base loosened by ya friendly old white ant not rot so I think this is going to be the best pieces :D . there are some fallen trees just 100 mtrs from my house Should be able to get permission to cut them up so a barrel of Aussie oak is looking very possible :dance:

[kiwikeg]

Hey I have tried this you need to weather it for 3 or 4 years so it really dried out so it tastes right but it works english oak is the same tree as french oak :dance: :dance: :dance:
also while you are creeping around parks looking at old trees keep an eye out for cork oaks http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quercus_suber those lovable pommy settlers went crazy planting them too, i gathered some acorns a few years ago from a protected cork oak planted by a settler a 150 years or so ago so now i got my own cork oak forest growing in pots on my deck.

i found this is useful too

research on NZ timbers for oaking wines
http://aut.researchgateway.ac.nz/handle/10292/2559

Full thesis here
http://aut.researchgateway.ac.nz/bitstr ... sequence=3

Acknowlegements: Kaushal, Monabeen

[crow]

Yeah I know where one is but its out of Sale in the gippsland miles from here :handgestures-thumbdown: . Some of the pieces I chose were white ant eaten heartwood that may have been dead inside the living tree for 50 yrs or more . I just did a little experiment just to get a slight idea of what I might expect . I burnt some of the ant eaten pieces or more to the point the harder timber they didn't eat put them in rum and heated it to 30' . Shook fuck out of it strained he rum whullha tastes something like Captain morgan so I'd say it looks promising

[devotus]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wood_drying

That link above basically says that air drying and careful drying is used if you want to work the timber. Chucking decent sized lumps of this oak in your oven and drying it quickly will distort it and maybe split it but won't have any detrimental effects on the use of it in booze. In other word you'll build a shit doghouse but make a great rum.

[crow]

Yes that's what I was thinking . If I need to build something I have about 60 lengths of tassie oak :)) . Maybe if this timber turns out to be good for aging spirit then I might season some for coopering but I would be foolish go to that trouble without conducting some tests first . I have read quite a number of reports and chemical analyses's showing variations in identical varieties of Quercus growing in different soils and climates . Things look really promising right now but it will take some months before I can be more certain , The other problem is some of these old trees are heritage listed but they may let me remove dead and fallen trees

[crow]

ok Experimental specimen was highly compromised (ran out of rum so I drank it) Starting it again tonight . A handful of charred locally grown Royal oak in white rum , take 2 Edit don't ask : just Take 3 might be a long experiment :roll: