Charred Vs Toasted

by **Frothwizard** » Fri Dec 20, 2013 1:40 am

Hey Guys,

So a few of us recently picked up some medium toasted american oak from Mrs Mac and I've been reading a lot on oaking but as I only have this one batch to compare it to, I'm having a hard time working out how long to leave it in for.

I read on a recent thread from LX that he'd over oaked his rum and was curious how you go about over oaking something rather than the spirit just getting smoother and smoother.

Does anyone have any simple rules they follow with regards to how much their oak is charred / toasted vs how long they leave it in their spirit?

by **Sam.** » Fri Dec 20, 2013 7:20 am

The oak you are talking about has already been toasted so there is no reason to re toast or char unless you want something different from it :handgestures-thumbupleft:

As for time if you want to leave it on oak for an extended period I wouldn't go over 15 grams per litre :handgestures-thumbupleft:

Patience is the key for aging in my opinion

by **Brendan** » Fri Dec 20, 2013 9:05 am

There's no real rules mate, I've found it's a guessing game depending on the product and the oak. Stick a bit in and see how it goes, if after a few months it doesn't look halfway, throw some more in ;-)

I had the problem where I was using some toasted oak dominos, and forgot that I hadn't charred them (was doing bourbon)...so at the 6 month mark it seemed really light and lacking complexity. Replaced the dominos with some that I charred and it completely changed! Apparently different flavours come from toasting and charring, and a lot of whiskey manufacturers toast and then char to get both :handgestures-thumbupleft:

At the moment, I'm ageing in 4L glass containers, and I'm using 2 6inch toasted and charred oak dominos and I don't touch it for 6 months, then constantly check from there...but that's just me. Some people can't fathom waiting 6 months :laughing-rolling:

by **Smbjk** » Fri Dec 20, 2013 9:14 am

I have found good results with using 2 10cm toasted american oak sticks in 2lt of 65 after a month or 2 I remove 1 and let sit till needed. I'm currently trying I toasted and 1 charred. Guess I'll suck it and see. Aal part of the experiment process

by **Brendan** » Fri Dec 20, 2013 9:36 am

Smbjk wrote:I have found good results with using 2 10cm toasted american oak sticks in 2lt of 65 after a month or 2 I remove 1 and let sit till needed. I'm currently trying I toasted and 1 charred. Guess I'll suck it and see. Aal part of the experiment process

If you're doing your own Smbjk, you should try toasting them and then charring them as well...Should get both flavour profiles from one piece :handgestures-thumbupleft:

by **BackyardBrewer** » Sun Dec 22, 2013 9:57 am

Overoaking is where you get the woody flavours too quickly without the smoothness. When you add too much it's not gently and gradually pulling flavour over time, it's dunking it in too quickly.

Which barrels you've got a slow movement of the spirit in and out of the wood with temperature change and evaporation of the spirit (the angels share) but if you chuck too much wood at it too quickly in the form of staves or dominoes you're going to get a drink that tastes like twigs.

by **Smbjk** » Sun Dec 22, 2013 11:45 am

Brendan wrote:
Smbjk wrote:I have found good results with using 2 10cm toasted american oak sticks in 2lt of 65 after a month or 2 I remove 1 and let sit till needed. I'm currently trying I toasted and 1 charred. Guess I'll suck it and see. Aal part of the experiment process

If you're doing your own Smbjk, you should try toasting them and then charring them as well...Should get both flavour profiles from one piece :handgestures-thumbupleft:

Thanks brendan thats exactly what it did. So now time will tell

by **OzKev** » Fri Dec 27, 2013 2:42 pm

Sorry if this is taking this offtopic, but I think it's just a continuation and not worth starting another thread for.

I'm playing with some of my first spirits runs. I've got some toasted and also some charred oak dominoes. I've oaked at 20g/L to push it through fairly quickly to get a first taste. What I have found is the toasted oak started to color the spirit very rapidly, within 3 hours I have some good color. The charred ones are not producing any color at all, even after 1 week. Also the toasted oak sinks, whilst the charred float? Is this normal?

by **Brendan** » Fri Dec 27, 2013 3:51 pm

OzKev wrote:Sorry if this is taking this offtopic, but I think it's just a continuation and not worth starting another thread for.

I'm playing with some of my first spirits runs. I've got some toasted and also some charred oak dominoes. I've oaked at 20g/L to push it through fairly quickly to get a first taste. What I have found is the toasted oak started to color the spirit very rapidly, within 3 hours I have some good color. The charred ones are not producing any color at all, even after 1 week. Also the toasted oak sinks, whilst the charred float? Is this normal?

The charred will sink, but does take longer than charred, that is normal. I find the charred floats on top for well over a week, but soon goes to the bottom. Obviously the charring makes the outer layer less absorptive, but the charring does have adsorptive properties to help filter out unwanted compounds/esters...