Recipe Discussion

[maheel]

i use a bit of both and basically it's for nutrients and balancing the wash for a better ferment.

some say you can leave out the EP- Salts

the box of EPS i bought is going to last years as you only need a pinch

i have a hunch if your using the TP with added salt that you should leave out the EPS. it's not based on anything scientific but :doh:
i prefer the no added salt TP

[wld trky]

I see, well Coles brand TP works and it's cheap. But doesn't salt kill yeast? I think it's just another thing I should try and see what happens.

Thanks for your reply.

[maheel]

But doesn't salt kill yeast?

it can in the right concentrations, but the pinch where adding should not kill the yeast.

IMO it's a more about balance etc (not that i am basing it on anything i really know about - NFI)

[Frank]

Im in the NFI club too :lol:
but I'm pretty sure :think: that the 'no salt' Tomato Paste is a better option re good fermentation..having tried both. I use Leggos No added salt and 500g gets me 2 x 25 litre washes....

[wld trky]

Sounds like i need to stand in Coles reading the labels again. Bloody hell :angry-banghead: .

[maheel]

Im in the NFI club too :lol:
but I'm pretty sure :think: that the 'no salt' Tomato Paste is a better option re good fermentation..having tried both. I use Leggos No added salt and 500g gets me 2 x 25 litre washes....

+1on leggos cost is a little higher :o lol maybe .50 cents? but i buy the yogurt tub ones..

I was using canned home brand from woollies but the salt was higher, seemed to struggle to get to .990 on "home brand" TP

[SBB]

Whats the difference between Epsom Salts and lemon juice. I see some have used either one or both.

From what Ive read on various forums and in different threads the two do completely different jobs.
The lemon juice is used to raise the acidity of your wash.
Epsome Salts also go's by the name of Magnesium Sulphate ....from what Ive read I gather that yeast loves magnesium and you need a certain amount of it to have a healthy yeast population. There is a fair bit more to the reasons yeast likes Epsom Salts from memory.
I use both in my TPW for those reasons.

[wld trky]

Bloody Hell not all tomato paste's are the same...

Sodium content of 2 brands,

Coles brand 420mg / 100g
Leggo's no added salt 48mg / 10

I will be using the leggo's from now on.

[SBB]

Ive used the Coles stuff....I probably wouldnt have if I had read the lables first......it didnt seem to make any difference, the wash still worked.

[busman]

I use the home brand stuff too, the difference in the salt content would only amount to a gram or two in a 50L wash so I wouldn't worry about it

[maheel]

I use the home brand stuff too, the difference in the salt content would only amount to a gram or two in a 50L wash so I wouldn't worry about it

Ive used the Coles stuff....I probably wouldnt have if I had read the lables first......it didnt seem to make any difference, the wash still worked.

yeah but you both live in NSW, up here in QLD we got fussy yeast and sugarz... :laughing-rolling:

i switched to leggos and true blue it's working better for me, NFI why btu i am happier :pray:

[SBB]

Whats the difference between Epsom Salts and lemon juice. I see some have used either one or both.

From what Ive read on various forums and in different threads the two do completely different jobs.
The lemon juice is used to raise the acidity of your wash.
Epsome Salts also go's by the name of Magnesium Sulphate ....from what Ive read I gather that yeast loves magnesium and you need a certain amount of it to have a healthy yeast population. There is a fair bit more to the reasons yeast likes Epsom Salts from memory.
I use both in my TPW for those reasons.

OK this has been playing on my mind and I just found what I was looking for.
Im not sure if there is any Calcium in in a tomatoe wash for that matter.

This is quoted from an AD thread by one of its members.
Quote:
Magnesium prevents agglomeration (clumping) caused by calcium, thus allowing yeast cells to reach full working potential. Here's the skinny...

<extract1>
Grit formation by agglomerating cells of baker’s yeast is an idiosyncratic phenomenon of irreversible cellular aggregation that is detrimental to yeast quality. Agglomeration results in failure of rehydrated dried yeast to evenly resuspend and has economic consequences for both yeast manufacturers and bakers.
</extract1>

<extract2>
Magnesium counteracted calcium promotion of agglomeration and it
was found that high c(Mg)/c(Ca) ratios in molasses reduced levels of yeast grit by 36–60 %. By increasing magnesium concentration in molasses growth media, a reduction in cellular calcium was observed and this concomitantly reduced the tendency of cells to aggregate and form grit.

Magnesium thus acted antagonistically against calcium-induced agglomeration, possibly by blocking calcium binding to yeast cell surface receptors.

[Frank]

WTF? :think: Hey SBB nice post (I think :? )...
So ANYBODY..... does this mean using epsom salts (and/or Leggos no salt tom paste for that matter ;) ) is a 'good thing' ? Seems like it anway....
What about citric acid (see first post in this thread)? I'd love to work out the 'best combination' TPW recipe here, based on science at least, if that's no too crazy. :text-thankyoublue:

[SBB]

Maybe Ive jumped the gun a bit posting that Frank....the original post related to molasses washes. Maybe it doesn't apply to TPW. From what I read I think It applies to yeasts in general. There was a link to a scientific paper with more on the subject attached to a post , but It doesnt appear to work anymore.

[jamjar]

Well I put down 160l using the low salt Leggos, and got to use a few lemons off my tree, now time will tell :) I ass a bit of powdered vitiam C seeing I am using town water, got that idea from another receipe.

[maheel]

i got a 60L TPW struggling to finish sitting just on 1000
interestingly this one has what looks like a floating yeast bed on the top ? (looks a bit like brains or hot/cold break)
it has had both some bakers and Punkins yeast
it's been in the barrel two weeks and is very cloudy and but very slowly working
it was heated so temp was not the issue i feel

i think the issue might be nutrients

i used punkins yeast in the all grain i am going to run tomorrow and it has sunk to the bottom and cleared no drama

should i mess with it? add some TP ? leave it alone ? normally i don't touch them but this one is strange looking smell / taste is "normal" and it does not seem infected etc

[bundy]

I'm having same problem with my 60l tpw put down on 19\9,thick crust on top have given it a stir a couple of time to break it up,but within an hour has crust back on top.wash seems to be clearing OK,smell OK,

[cheeko]

Hey People

I have heaps of Dextrose can get it cheap would you still use 5kg of dextrose for 25L wash or more
People thoghts

[maheel]

go 6kg should be fine

[cheeko]

Cheers will do