Rum Recipe Discussion

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Re: Rum Recipe Discussion

Postby Nathan02 » Sat May 29, 2021 1:32 pm

Dont rack it, ferment it as warm as possible and run it dirty minus the yeast bed. Better flavour :handgestures-thumbupleft:
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Re: Rum Recipe Discussion

Postby The Stig » Sat May 29, 2021 1:37 pm

Nathan02 wrote:Dont rack it, ferment it as warm as possible and run it dirty minus the yeast bed. Better flavour :handgestures-thumbupleft:

Agree :text-+1:
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Re: Rum Recipe Discussion

Postby Clickeral » Thu Jun 17, 2021 12:48 pm

Aiming to do a batch tonight, had issues with acidity and seems to have finished at 1.050, doesn't feel sticky or taste sweet so may just be unfermentable sugar etc. Will run it on low heat and see how I go.
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Re: Rum Recipe Discussion

Postby indenial » Thu Jun 17, 2021 3:45 pm

Clickeral wrote:Aiming to do a batch tonight, had issues with acidity and seems to have finished at 1.050, doesn't feel sticky or taste sweet so may just be unfermentable sugar etc. Will run it on low heat and see how I go.


Let us know how you go, as I am in a similar situation.1.050 seems very high. Mine is at 1.060!
I am not sure what is going on but I have a couple of theories. Do you know what the SG was to start with?

Sorry for the novel that follows but I've really tried to solve this one on my own without success. This is more about learning and problem solving than rescuing a 20l wash.

History:
This is 2nd generation 20l MacRum using yeast cake and 25% dunder from 1st generation. Molasses was 2.5l which was 2nd half of 5l stockfeed molasses container used on 1st gen (which fermented quickly without issue). Fermentation fridge set at 30degC
Didn't take initial SG or pH
No bubbling on air lock - assumed leaky seal.
After 10 days no apparent krausen and took gravity - 1.074 - discovered old pH meter no long working. Added a teaspoon of shell grit (preboiled) in case pH was the issue.
No noticable fermentation
After 14 days took gravity - 1.070 - added another teaspoon of shell grit and 1/2 teaspoon of DAP. Oxygenated wash and pitched around 80g of hydrated bakers yeast.
No noticeable fermentation.
After 16 days - 1.064 - new pH meter (calibrated) reads 3.6 - added a tablespoon of shell grit
After 18days - 1.064 - pH 3.8 - added 1/2 teaspoon of soda ash (Sodium carbonate).
After 20 days 1.060 - ph 3.9 - added 1 teaspoon of soda ash
After 22 days 1.060 pH 3.9 - added 3 tablespoon shell grit, made a "yeast bomb" with vitamin B, DAP, boiled yeast. Diluted wash to 26l. Then pitched 80g bakers yeast. After 1 hour, some airlock activity. This morning - no airlock activity.

Taste isn't sweet at all, but I don't know if any sweetness is overwhelmed by the acid.

Things I've ruled out:
Dead yeast- active yeast (used some sugar to confirm) has gone in twice now
Ferment temps - fridge is keeping a pretty steady temp around 29 - 30 degC. There is a BWKO in the same fridge that has gone through nearly 3 generations in the last 15 days.
Molasses preservatives/additives - whatever is in the molasses worked fine for gen 1. This molasses comes out of the exact same container.


Theories:
1. Acidic beasty has taken over?
Either the laws of chemistry have been suspended or something in my wash is pumping out acid faster than I can add shell grit.
I have been doing a lot of reading. Apparently molasses can contain bacteria/yeast that is tolerant to high temperatures (like up to 75degC). I inverted the sugar but possibly didn't boil the molasses.
From memory I might've just put some hot water in the container and got the molasses "pourable". So some other beasty has taken over and pumps out acid the yeast doesn't like.

2. Ferment has finished?
As per clickeral, for some reason I've got a lot of unfermentables? The only thing that leads to this is the taste and the fact there always seems to be gas coming out of solution when I mess with it.
Apparently some lacto infections can produce CO2 as well though???

3. ??????????

Possible plans of attack?
1. Run it, just like Clickeral is going to. Won't use the yeast cake for 3rd gen, probably boil it for yeast nutrient - or use it to start a dunder pit?
2. Boil the whole wash, allow to cool and re-pitch yeast.
3. Tip it all into the compost and use my tears to hydrate the yeast of the next batch.

Would love any other suggestions, thoughts analysis that anyone can offer.
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Re: Rum Recipe Discussion

Postby bluc » Thu Jun 17, 2021 4:12 pm

I am going with reason 1 acidity beastie and am guessing "brett infection". use star san.

second guess is buffering capacity of water is low and is lacto(unlikely).

was there any growth on top?
I lost 3 ferments in a row with no top growth at all. Sanitised with star san and problem went away.( Brett I think, previous successful ferment was full of butyric) Lacto generally grows a pellicle.
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Re: Rum Recipe Discussion

Postby indenial » Thu Jun 17, 2021 4:26 pm

Bluc, no growth at all on top. So brett looks like the culprit.

I'll tip it out and get cleaning. Thanks for your help.
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Re: Rum Recipe Discussion

Postby Clickeral » Thu Jun 17, 2021 4:44 pm

Didn't take a gravity reading when it started, bubbled for ages so I know it was fermenting. I did use some really old dunder in this batch so that may have impacted it however no growth on top

I did this batch awhile ago so can't remember exact measurements but pretty sure it was a recipe that I used to do regularly so was pretty confident with it

Doesn't taste any different to normal rum washes Ive done in the past, my hydrometer is calibrated so I know that isnt the issue

Ph seems to be ok, based on my litmus tests, I did add more yeast and some calcium carbonate to see if I could get it down more it did bubble a bit more and then stopped.

The other possibility is that I have got to an alcohol percentage that the yeast can't handle. I very much doubt this however as I do molasses only rum washes and I am pretty sure in the 57L batch I didn't put that much molasses in.

Will run it and see how I go, part of me was tempted to split it water it down add some sugar and see if I can kick it off again but tbh I can't be bothered

Worst case I clean everything up, start a new gen and then use that to start a new dunder pit etc I still have part of a bucket left of molasses that needs using up. Might go buy some more this weekend if I have the time

Will report back, first time I have ever had an issue
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Re: Rum Recipe Discussion

Postby Clickeral » Thu Jun 17, 2021 6:26 pm

indenial wrote:Bluc, no growth at all on top. So brett looks like the culprit.

I'll tip it out and get cleaning. Thanks for your help.


I would just run it, running mine atm and plates stacked no problem, had the typical Puke risk as I'm almost full so only using 2400w (also residual sugar doesn't help)

Will see how much yield I get out of it
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Re: Rum Recipe Discussion

Postby Clickeral » Thu Jun 17, 2021 8:02 pm

Yeah so start of take off at 90%ish now taken 3 jars St around 85% have had puking however so my first plate is covered. I even used an empty tee as a spacer lol
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Re: Rum Recipe Discussion

Postby Clickeral » Thu Jun 17, 2021 10:17 pm

Right 12 400ml jars full stayed pretty high till the last 3-4 so yeild was fine, thinking maybe the yeast died due to alcohol, so maybe need to add more water next time. Don't think I added any old rum low wines to the ferment buf maybe I did, hmm overall its pretty tasty from the tastes I did. Will let air and do cuts tomorrow before I age on oak (will probably do a bottle of white as well)
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Re: Rum Recipe Discussion

Postby indenial » Fri Jun 18, 2021 2:14 pm

Clickeral wrote:Right 12 400ml jars full stayed pretty high till the last 3-4 so yeild was fine,

Nice result!
You've convinced me to give mine a go. Might be some interesting flavours, even if I don't get much alcohol out of it.
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Re: Rum Recipe Discussion

Postby Clickeral » Fri Jun 18, 2021 2:43 pm

indenial wrote:
Clickeral wrote:Right 12 400ml jars full stayed pretty high till the last 3-4 so yeild was fine,

Nice result!
You've convinced me to give mine a go. Might be some interesting flavours, even if I don't get much alcohol out of it.


Just be really careful towards the end of the run, I had a massive cleanup after due to puking and the last 3 jars smell heavily of smoke/burnt sugar etc think it was the puking burning at the end etc. Jars before this are fine, so trying to decide what I do with the last 3 (they are all tails and cloudy as hell)

Next batch ill try and get to ferment out lower if possible

Overall its tasting really rummy and needs to age, might even be too rummy for a bottle of white this time but will see how it stands up once I water some down.

Will do at least a 3L cookie jar on oak and then either run the rest in the next rum batch or do some white etc but currently undecided
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Re: Rum Recipe Discussion

Postby BigRig » Fri Jun 18, 2021 7:21 pm

BigRig wrote:Need some advice from the rum guys please.

I did my first spirit run this arvo (30L) and collected 32 jars of approx 250ml which are now airing. I actually ran out of the smaller jars so collected another 3 or 4 litres in larger jars.

Jars 31 & 32 plus the 3 bigger jars had a smell like butterscotch / caramel so assuming it was tails but it wasnt the unpleasant wet dog smell i am accustomed to with TPW. If i kept running it will it eventually get to wet dog smell ?

I ran out of time and jars so shut the still down, the spirit was still coming off @ 68%abv.

I have almost 10L of stripped wash left over so i was gonna add this to the boiler with the caramel jars and finishing running the still tomorrow. Otherwise i will keep it for next run and just finish running whats left in the boiler (i didnt empty it).

Am i on the right track ?


Had my first taste tonight after 3 months on oak and WOW this is so much nicer than i was expecting even considering all the good reviews it gets.

Wont touch it now for another 9 months.
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Re: Rum Recipe Discussion

Postby Clickeral » Sat Jun 26, 2021 9:59 am

So seems that none of the petstores out my way (western Melbourne suburbs) sell molasses so ended up buying some online with delivery

pethorsefarm.com.au could have driven to Keilor or towards Geelong for pickup but I am in no rush

Have 30L fermenting at the moment as I ran out of molasses, have 50kg on the way so will fix that next weekend :)
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Re: Rum Recipe Discussion

Postby CyBaThUg » Mon Sep 27, 2021 11:44 am

Will .36% sulphur cause an issue in molasses
Last edited by CyBaThUg on Mon Sep 27, 2021 11:44 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Rum Recipe Discussion

Postby Clickeral » Mon Sep 27, 2021 12:39 pm

CyBaThUg wrote:Will .36% sulphur cause an issue in molasses


No, the copper in the still will strip it out anyway

The stockfeed queensland molasses I use has 0.4% sulfur
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Re: Rum Recipe Discussion

Postby CyBaThUg » Mon Sep 27, 2021 4:31 pm

Excellent thanks
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Re: Rum Recipe Discussion

Postby BigRig » Sat Oct 23, 2021 12:36 pm

I made a stockfeed all molasses rum last weekend and it stinks.

Taste and smell of the wash was very good, taste of the spirit is very good but damn its hard to bring the demijohn to my nose for a sniff. Has been on french oak for a week.

Hopefully the smell will improve.

I have this separate to my mcrum stock and will keep it that way.
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Re: Rum Recipe Discussion

Postby BigRig » Tue Oct 26, 2021 8:03 am

BigRig wrote:I made a stockfeed all molasses rum last weekend and it stinks.

Taste and smell of the wash was very good, taste of the spirit is very good but damn its hard to bring the demijohn to my nose for a sniff. Has been on french oak for a week.

Hopefully the smell will improve.

I have this separate to my mcrum stock and will keep it that way.


The "stink" has now settled and it smells good after 2 weeks. Only 50 weeks to go.
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Re: Rum Recipe Discussion

Postby RC Al » Tue Oct 26, 2021 7:17 pm

:laughing-rolling: yup welcome to rum :teasing-tease:
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