davecuds wrote:Ok, so I'm doing something wrong here. I had the flame on this thing for what seemed like 10mins. I could get a bit of the 2% silver solder to melt but wouldn't go anywhere from there. I'm using map gas. Any suggestions? :text-coolphotos:
I'd say that torch is not meant for MAP-Pro gas. MAPP/MAP-Pro gas torches typically have a stainless steel end nozzle to contend with the (very slightly) higher flame temperature, and for the high output BernzOmatic MAP-Pro torches the flame shape is very different to the flame in your picture. Note, the gas you can buy today is not the original MAPP formula, it is a substitute. The BernzOmatic stuff is now sold as MAP-Pro.
I believe your torch is your problem. You need a torch that will use more gas and put out far more joules of heat energy, but using two torches will not necessarily give you the result you expect. I have been there. I have the cheap BernzOmatic all brass torch, and I have the BernzOmatic TS8000 torch, and they are chalk and cheese. It appears to me that the TS8000 torch will use around three times the gas of the cheap BernzOmatic propane torch.
Propane with the BernzOmatic TS8000 torch will get a given surface area and weight of copper hot enough to use the Tradelink supplied 15% silver hard silver solder rods that I have been buying. As the surface area and weight of copper goes up, heat soak makes it difficult to get the job hot enough to hard silver solder. It gets to the point where the rod will melt onto the job, but the rod deposit is not fully liquid and becomes lumpy.
Instead of using BernzOmatic gas, I have been using this cylinder from Bunnings. It holds more gas than the 400g BernzOmatic cylinders and is far cheaper, and I am using that gas with 15% silver hard silver solder rods. This appears to be the same cylinder as your "fat boy" cylinder.
http://www.bunnings.com.au/gasmate-outd ... -_p3170722Here is a bit of hard soldering I did a few days ago using Propane through the TS8000 torch with 15% silver hard rods from Tradelink (item code 031118) . You can see that while I have been able to hard solder the parts together, there are lumps evident where I just cannot fully get the hard rod to liquidus, or fully liquid temperature. The tube is the same outer diameter as the outer dia of the 2 1/2 inch to 2 inch reducer, and so is butted to the reducer. I have put the ring band around the joint to overlap the join and add a bit of strength. The Stainless Steel tri-clamp flange is also attached to the copper using 15% hard silver solder rod...
As a matter of interest from the BernzOmatic web site...
"MAP-Pro™: Flame temperature in air is 3,730 degrees F. Ideal for soldering larger size copper pipes, brazing, heat-treating. Higher flame temperature and better combustion intensity allows tasks to be completed more quickly. Choose a torch specially designed for MAP-Pro™ fuel."
"Propane: Flame temperature in air is 3,600 degrees F. Ideal for soldering copper pipes, heating frozen pipes and rusted nuts, softening paint and other low-heat DIY projects. A self-igniting torch is safer and more reliable than a spark. Pick a wide flame for most applications which don't need pinpoint-type heat."
"A single torch flame has many different temperatures. For any gas, the hottest part of the flame is at the tip of the inner flame, where the pale outer flame meets the darker inner flame."