continuous boiler

by **DrunkASAskunk** » Tue Jun 25, 2013 8:17 am

I have been pondering how I could save some time with my stilling. So I thought I would post this thought I had and see if I can get some feed back from every one.

continuous still.jpg

The heat element would be sitting in a trough. Each trough would flow in to the next one working its way to the bottom then out of the boiler.
First thought is to use a bunch of Mac'c elements but the problem there would be the amount of wat's I would need to run 6 to 8 elements. All I would end up doing there is fucking my house wiring.
I think this could work if I could get a element that can heat to high temps but at a low wat.

Thoughts please guys I need yours.

by **JayD** » Tue Jun 25, 2013 8:39 am

There is a lot of info regarding the continuous distilling on you tube that the petroleum industry has loaded up giving a great insight to this continuous method from what I have seen you realy only need one heat source as the wash is introduced into the vapour path and vapourises sending the goodies up and the heavies down...more to it than this but once you watch a couple of the vids you gain some insight. This may not be info your after but it may help you out with your intended build.
J :handgestures-thumbupleft:

by **Dominator** » Tue Jun 25, 2013 8:53 am

Thanks a lot Jay (sarcastic), now I am gonna spend the next 2 hours looking at continuous boilers on you tube. :teasing-nutkick: :laughing-rolling:

The power rating (watts) of an element has nothing to do with how hot it will get (if you take away variables like boiler efficiency). For the sake of this explanation we will say all elements will get hot enough to boil your wash, different elements have different heat rating before they will burn out. The higher your power, the faster your wash will boil, or in the case of a continuous boiler, the higher your power, the faster you will be able to add wash to you boiler and keep it boiling. If you are just planing on running this off a household power point then your not going to want to go over 2400W total power. For 6 trays this would mean 6 x 400W elements, for 8 trays, 8 x 300W elements. If you can run off two power points on separate circuits, like I do for my boiler with two 2400W FSD elements, then you could double your element sizing, ie. 8 x 600W elements.
Once you decide on your element sizes you will have to do some trial and error to work out how deep you can make the tray, and how fast you can add wash to keep it boiling.

Now for my speculation on problems you may have with the current design (please don't take this the wrong way as I would love to see this work).
The wash on the top tray is theoretically going to be higher ABV than the trays below. A higher water content and thus higher boiling point on the lower trays may cause problems. It could be as simple as slowing down your wash input or having slightly larger elements on the bottom than the top.
An initial problem may be monitoring the output from the boiler to be sure that your removing all, or at least the majority, of the alcohol in the wash.
Correct me if I am wrong but a continuous boiler would only work for stripping as your going to be getting heads and tails through the whole run. This would mean your boiler would be a one horse pony and you would also need a conventional boiler for your spirit runs.

I am gonna keep a close eye on this thread and see what come of it. Hope I helped mate.

by **BackyardBrewer** » Tue Jun 25, 2013 8:58 am

This vid was posted on YouTube ages ago. It's a Russian guys supposed continuous still.

I'm not convinced this is an economical or safe way to go, but see if this is what you're talking about.

http://youtu.be/WoyAOp92RwI

Plenty more on YouTube just search continuous distillation.

by **Yummyrum** » Tue Jun 25, 2013 9:11 am

Here's a link to one on HD. It uses a packed column as apposed to plates http://homedistiller.org/equip/cont

These things are only good for stripping as you still have the heads and fores in the output ( Not an issue for Fuel).So you need to batch distill the output afterwards.

In your design you would need some kind of refluxing to set up the fractions to strip out the water .I would also recon more plates above the feed point as well

Are you having an element on each plate ? Is the Idea to have each at a different temp decreasing as you go up ?

by **Aussiedownunder01** » Tue Jun 25, 2013 9:22 am

These refinery cracker tower run continuous

by **DrunkASAskunk** » Tue Jun 25, 2013 9:42 am

Yes I could just build a continuous still. But the thought behind a continuous boiler would be that you could have a pot still on top or a modular still.

Dominator wrote:Thanks a lot Jay (sarcastic), now I am gonna spend the next 2 hours looking at continuous boilers on you tube. :teasing-nutkick: :laughing-rolling:

Now for my speculation on problems you may have with the current design (please don't take this the wrong way as I would love to see this work).
The wash on the top tray is theoretically going to be higher ABV than the trays below. A higher water content and thus higher boiling point on the lower trays may cause problems. It could be as simple as slowing down your wash input or having slightly larger elements on the bottom than the top.
An initial problem may be monitoring the output from the boiler to be sure that your removing all, or at least the majority, of the alcohol in the wash.
Correct me if I am wrong but a continuous boiler would only work for stripping as your going to be getting heads and tails through the whole run. This would mean your boiler would be a one horse pony and you would also need a conventional boiler for your spirit runs.

I am gonna keep a close eye on this thread and see what come of it. Hope I helped mate.

All good mate I have not taken it the rong way this is the type of feed back i want. You are right the top trys are going to have a higher ABV than the lower. One thought I had was to have power controlers on each of the elements. The top one will all ways need the most power to heat but once the wash is on the bottom heat element it will all ready be at the needed temp. So I would think it would need alot less power. Even if it only worked with a pot still on top it would still save alot of time when it came to running 200lt of wash. All that stopping and starting drives me up the wall.

by **crow** » Wed Jun 26, 2013 12:39 am

Unless you are going to have a secondary column with multipliable take off points you will only be able to use this for stripping, can't see the benefit with batch distillation myself

by **DrunkASAskunk** » Thu Jun 27, 2013 12:29 am

I think your all right trying to build a continuous boiler is one of them things it will probly work but probly not the way I would want it to. So this only gives me one choice build a continuous still.
I am thinking build one just like the pro's use just smaller. So I am probly going to want it to be 4 inch twin tower. First colum I will use perf plates the secon I am thinking of bubble caps.
At this point the main problem I am fasted with is what to do for my heat sorce. I like the idear of having a wood fed heat sorce. Right now your all thinking why wood fire it is so dangerus
and yes your right but that dose not need to be on top of the still it can be set back at a safe distance. From the old continuous still desins I have looking at, some use steam while it looks like some also use piping hot water rather than steam. Not shaw if I would get the heat I need from plain old hot water any thought on that ?? .
Any thought on how many plats per colum I should be thinking about using. You need to be thinking rum, whisky and bourbon.
I will post some pic's in a sec of the build plans.

by **crow** » Thu Jun 27, 2013 1:58 am

I think i would rather see a member post about building a 18" column than a continuous still less if they have a licence. difficulties of take off aside why would you want a still that is capable of continuous distillation. Take into consideration that I read this on my phone and have replied with the last of my credit on my PC to make this point. Yes it can be done but the important question is why ( Hmm where'd I leave that 9 iron)

by **DrunkASAskunk** » Thu Jun 27, 2013 2:01 am

contin still 1 .jpg

First draft

by **DrunkASAskunk** » Thu Jun 27, 2013 2:06 am

contin still 3.jpg

contin still 2.jpg

by **crow** » Thu Jun 27, 2013 2:21 am

:-| PM sent

by **DrunkASAskunk** » Thu Jun 27, 2013 2:48 am

crow wrote::-| PM sent

pm sent back

by **Yummyrum** » Thu Jun 27, 2013 8:20 pm

crow wrote:........ difficulties of take off aside why would you want a still that is capable of continuous distillation. ..........Yes it can be done but the important question is why

I regularly ponder continuous stills for two reasons .A challenge ,and also I can't help wonder if there is something in it that gives Bundy that Bundy flavour.

I get the drift that having a continuous still means that one could produce at a rate which would exceed what is considered a hobby quantity but personally ,I have a hard enough job getting my shit together to do enough for a single run let alone run two one after another.And when one considers that most Licensed micro-distilleries have batch stills ,i don't see the issue.

To me ,I would like to see if there is anything in the run of a continuous still that makes the Rum flavour I like .Put 50 liters through it .Pack it up till next time .

by **MacStill** » Thu Jun 27, 2013 9:54 pm

Question,

How do you do cuts from a continuous still that has fresh wash entering the boiler throughout the run ?

I already know the answer ;-)

by **karrotbear** » Fri Jun 28, 2013 11:31 am

No cuts at all, just market that it has been filtered :handgestures-thumbupleft:

by **crow** » Sun Jul 07, 2013 11:53 pm

Ok it looks like my comments shut down this conversation and that wasn't really my intention I just wanted someone to outline a legitimate reason why they would want a still or boiler set up with this capability before we discussed the designs and theory further :roll: Ok seems my point might have been misinterpreted so might be best if I outline at least one reason. One legitimate reason for using this set up that comes to mind is say a distiller has a lot of perishables on hand to ferment at once. Once fermented they may wish to strip the whole lot to low wines so as to distil later at leisure :-B . I could see where this sort of system might want to be explored to this end :handgestures-thumbupleft:
Discuss away and I will not to make negative contributions (within subject condoned by the forum of course)

by **Yummyrum** » Mon Jul 08, 2013 12:21 am

Crow ,yeah I thought maybe there were some hints going on to not discuss further .Some forums don't condone this discussion which is a shame .Its always steered towards don't go there.

Thanks for clearing that up .Keen on this ,too tired now though .Big Dog needs his sleep now

by **crow** » Mon Jul 08, 2013 1:07 am

Yummyrum wrote:Crow ,yeah I thought maybe there were some hints going on to not discuss further .Some forums don't condone this discussion which is a shame .Its always steered towards don't go there.

Thanks for clearing that up .Keen on this ,too tired now though .Big Dog needs his sleep now

Ye no problemo's just needs to be remmebered that these forums are for discussing legitimate "hobby" distillation,we have legitimate commercial interests here to and thats fine to :handgestures-thumbupleft: . I doubt we would be tolerated long otherwise, hence why I wanted the discussion legitimised (not to be the fun police) :-B