Punchy21's Controller Diagram for the CSVC

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Re: Punchy21's Controller Diagram for the CSVC

Postby warramungas » Tue Sep 20, 2016 9:20 am

tristans wrote:I was going off the diagrams in the SSR, which i think are circuits designed for processes where you need to protect things elsewhere in the circuit. I'm happy to give this a bash without the signal controller thing the data sheet refers to.

One other question, the diagrams have fans in them. I was going to add a heat sink, which obviously need a bit of air flow. Has anyone has any luck doing it without fans and just a heat sink? I was looking a power supplys/transformers, and they seem dear for a 5w unit (like $80), when a 100w unit is like $20. I'm looking at an analog voltmeter (to cut down on the fluctuations), so if I can get away without the fans, I'm sure I can save a fair bit on that power supply. Otherwise I'll need to work something out.Maybe an old lead acid backup battery to run the fans.

Cheers again!

T

I got a 240 volt fan from jaycar (I think) for $30. Saved a lot of naffing around with transformers.
I think it was the most expensive item in my box. My fan is switchable only because I don't want it running when only the stc is on to try and make it last as long as possible.
Plus my box has computer cable iec connections which all have their own 10 amp fuses.
Also mine had only the ssr, heat sink and pid(we'll call it the pot). I don't think it NEEDS all the other stuff to work. 240 in, 240 out and the controller attached to the control side.
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Re: Punchy21's Controller Diagram for the CSVC

Postby tristans » Tue Sep 20, 2016 9:40 am

Thanks Wara, thats a great idea, I'll go have a geez at jaycar for fans on 240 with switches.

Yeah i need to plan this out a bit. I'm thinking box, punchy's design - transformers/digital readouts. Then its just 2 sinple circuits, 1 with the SSR/pot/Voltmeter and another with the fan and a switch. If the IEC plugs have a fuse in them even better, protects the lot. Is the one you have the IEC plug with the switch on it?

Thanks for the feedback, I've spent so much time on the still and washes now I've just got this last element before its getting close to ready.

CHeers

T
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Re: Punchy21's Controller Diagram for the CSVC

Postby warramungas » Tue Sep 20, 2016 11:59 am

tristans wrote:Thanks Wara, thats a great idea, I'll go have a geez at jaycar for fans on 240 with switches.

Yeah i need to plan this out a bit. I'm thinking box, punchy's design - transformers/digital readouts. Then its just 2 sinple circuits, 1 with the SSR/pot/Voltmeter and another with the fan and a switch. If the IEC plugs have a fuse in them even better, protects the lot. Is the one you have the IEC plug with the switch on it?

Thanks for the feedback, I've spent so much time on the still and washes now I've just got this last element before its getting close to ready.

CHeers

T


Its a lot easier to wire it without the iec connectors but they're cheap from ebay and my box has three items built into it. That's why I have a fan switch. Only two of them need the fan.
My original build thread is here if you want a look.
http://www.aussiedistiller.com.au/viewt ... =60&t=8857
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Re: Punchy21's Controller Diagram for the CSVC

Postby Professor Green » Tue Sep 20, 2016 7:28 pm

tristans wrote:Hi all, I've got a couple of questions about using the PSR-25..

I'm looking at the data sheets and its got an F175 supply filter in the circuit, for what i assume is protection for the rest of the circuit? Or is that performed by the SCR fuse in this diagram? (I've attached the RS components data sheet)
...

I was wondering a) what it does and b) whether its needed.
...

T


From the American Automation web page:

Phase-angle power controllers generate Radio Frequency Interference (RFI) during each half-cycle of the mains waveform when the power is switched on. In sensitive applications this interference, or interaction with other equipment, must be suppressed to comply with the Electromagnetic Compatibility Regulations 1992 (SI 1992 No.2372). Appropriate suppression may be achieved by the addition of a series choke and capacitor network incorporated in a filter module. The F-type series filter modules have been manufactured to complement the UAL range of phase angle power controllers.


Cheers,
Prof. Green.
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Re: Punchy21's Controller Diagram for the CSVC

Postby Carbonator » Tue Sep 20, 2016 8:31 pm

I saw this setup at a mate's place. It runs twin 2400W elements and he has been using it for years - simple and industrial.

02.JPG

03.JPG
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Re: Punchy21's Controller Diagram for the CSVC

Postby tristans » Sun Oct 09, 2016 1:29 pm

Been away for a while now, but I've built myself a nice little box using the suggestions above.

Only thing i was curious about. These phase angle controllers seem to control the neutral on the way out rather than the positive.... does that seem right? I would have thought its easier to control the positive, meaning the earth and neutral stay basically the same.

Cheers all, I'll start positing in the stillin areas once I've got this baby up and running.

Cheers

T
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Re: Punchy21's Controller Diagram for the CSVC

Postby rumdidlydum » Mon Oct 10, 2016 9:37 pm

tristans wrote:Been away for a while now, but I've built myself a nice little box using the suggestions above.

Only thing i was curious about. These phase angle controllers seem to control the neutral on the way out rather than the positive.... does that seem right? I would have thought its easier to control the positive, meaning the earth and neutral stay basically the same.

Cheers all, I'll start positing in the stillin areas once I've got this baby up and running.

Cheers

T

That's what the diagram say's ;-)
I have mine wired up this way and I haven't had any issues. While your talking to the sparky (as he is testing your controller) you can ask the question. :handgestures-thumbupleft:
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Re: Punchy21's Controller Diagram for the CSVC

Postby tristans » Tue Oct 11, 2016 7:36 am

Yeah he raised the question, and it works fine. The only issue is that the neutral and earth aren't the same potential when its done this way.

I'll have a chat to some of the electrical engineers at work. It works fine how it is (and I have safety switches!), but there might prove to be a better way in future. Seems so much easier to chop the 240Vac live rather than the return.

Anyway, thanks for all the help peeps :) Just finishing the last parts of the still.
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Re: Punchy21's Controller Diagram for the CSVC

Postby punchy21 » Wed Oct 12, 2016 9:01 pm

If i recall correctly, both ways will work however the manufacturer recommended using the neutral, hence the diagram... :handgestures-thumbupleft:
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Re: Punchy21's Controller Diagram for the CSVC

Postby scythe » Thu Oct 13, 2016 5:25 am

Just watch that you don't feed certain components a chopped wave, they dont like it and will have a considerably shorter life span.
The cheap ebay (blue back light?) readout screens come to mind.
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Re: Punchy21's Controller Diagram for the CSVC

Postby warramungas » Thu Oct 13, 2016 11:23 am

scythe wrote:Just watch that you don't feed certain components a chopped wave, they dont like it and will have a considerably shorter life span.
The cheap ebay (blue back light?) readout screens come to mind.


Shouldn't the readout be fed direct from the mains and have the output from the ssr through the induction loop?
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Re: Punchy21's Controller Diagram for the CSVC

Postby tristans » Thu Oct 13, 2016 2:36 pm

I'm only running the chopped wave to the potentiometer (analogue) and the element.... its literally just a resistor, so shoukd handle the chopped wave ok.

Cheers for the info :)
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Re: Punchy21's Controller Diagram for the CSVC

Postby sok1974 » Thu Mar 16, 2017 4:41 pm

Hi there electrically competent people.
Quick noobie question.
Is the potentiometer supplying an in phase voltage to the neutral or
have I just shown my lack of electrical knowledge?

Don't worry I'm not wiring one but if I do I can easy have it checked
by an electrician. I'm only just starting 3 year and do almost no domestic wiring.
I do have daily access to many competent EFMs though.

Thanks for the great info.
Simon
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Re: Punchy21's Controller Diagram for the CSVC

Postby sok1974 » Fri Mar 17, 2017 7:05 am

Spent a bit more time looking at the diagram.

Ok I think I got it this time. The psr25 and potentiometer
Just provide variable resistance from 0-240v so the voltage
Is shared by those and the element.
That right?
Sorry about the above question.

Simon
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Re: Punchy21's Controller Diagram for the CSVC

Postby rumdidlydum » Fri Mar 17, 2017 8:15 pm

From my understanding, the pot is introducing a resistance to the signal voltage, which then controls the SSR to put out the voltage required :-B :handgestures-thumbupleft:
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Re: Punchy21's Controller Diagram for the CSVC

Postby Pottsy1985 » Mon Sep 11, 2017 9:56 pm

Hi,

Reviving a dead thread! I've been looking into how a power controller would work for my t500 boiler. I've come across a video on YouTube and was wondering if this is exactly how it would work?

https://youtu.be/_LwUR7YtWZg

So I have an electrician mate that I would get to do this but was just wondering if that video explains the process.

1. Get parts for controller and put together
2. Cut an extension lead, wire active wires to controller
3. Build box, put in box for safety
4. Plug extension lead into wall, plug boiler into other end of extension lead
5. Adjust power

If this video is correct it's a lot easier than I thought and I'm glad no cords on the boiler have to be cut :shock:

Thanks guys
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Re: Punchy21's Controller Diagram for the CSVC

Postby Pottsy1985 » Mon Sep 11, 2017 10:09 pm

Sorry if this comment should be in a different thread :naughty:
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Re: Punchy21's Controller Diagram for the CSVC

Postby Doubleuj » Wed Sep 13, 2017 4:02 pm

Just be careful watching you tube vids for this sort of stuff.
Your sparky will understand the diagram, mine did while I couldn't.
Are you going analog or digital display?
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Re: Punchy21's Controller Diagram for the CSVC

Postby Pottsy1985 » Thu Sep 14, 2017 12:23 pm

Doubleuj wrote:Just be careful watching you tube vids for this sort of stuff.
Your sparky will understand the diagram, mine did while I couldn't.
Are you going analog or digital display?


Thanks for your reply Doubleuj,

I ended up buying one of these

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/220V-4000W-A ... 2749.l2649

Still waiting for it. But it should do the job right?
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Re: Punchy21's Controller Diagram for the CSVC

Postby dave from downunder » Thu Sep 28, 2017 4:33 pm

punchy21 wrote:Gday everyone, I was a bit hesitant about posting this for various safety reasons but decided it would be of more benefit than harm.

As everyone is aware, electricity is not to be taken lightly. You rarely get a second chance when it comes to an electric shock.

If you decide to take this project on, and are not an electrician, then you must get it checked by an electrician.

agreedsafemethod.png


*Comments and advice in this post should be considered as general in nature, and you should always seek expert advice on matters that might affect yours and others safety, liability and insurance cover.*



That all looks good to me.
I would suggest a double pole switch on it just in case you plug into a lead with the active and neutral reversed (very common).
I would change the volt meter and/or add an ammeter as the current is what you what to monitor.
Yes I am an electrician.

Cheers
Dave
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