New multi-controller build.

[warramungas]

Hi.
Have decided to upgrade from my old sutronics burst fire controller which doesn't seem to like my newer boilers electronics to a combination of src and temperature controls.
Trying to make flavoured spirits without a power controller was a disaster for my pot still (de-refluxed LM head).
I decided to go with a STC-1000 which I had from years ago for mashing if I ever want to, a 10000 watt SCR controller for controlling the power, and a 40 amp PID controller for my boiler. Would've preferred an ally box but they didn't have one wide enough at jaycar.
I'll only ever run one at a time (probably) so they'll all be in the same box but wired independently to each other. The only exception is I'll be running the SCR controller through a power meter to get a bit of feedback what's going on. The power meter just has a hole the bale goes through so no physical connecting required. The other two will be either on or off depending on the temperature so full draw as required.
Here' all the bits laid out sans wire.

All the bits laid out.jpg

This is what they will look like roughly placed in the box. There's a 240volt fan on the top but don't think I'll need it. It's in place just in case it's needed. The IEC connectors (min 4 possibly 5 or 6) I'll be using have a lot of holes so will allow airflow through them. I'll have a fan cover on the top of the case with a filter and the fan will draw through it and blow out around the IEC connectors.

Part placed roughly in position.jpg

And here's what the front of the box will look like minus where the SCR potentiometer knob will go in the open space there on the right.

Marked up box.jpg

I tried to cut the holes with a Stanley knife but could see I going to make a mess of it so I'm going to take it to work on Monday night to get my hands on some scrap electrical cable for the wiring and some better tools. Plenty of gear I can borrow in the electrical workshop.
Any thoughts about the wiring as I'm not sure what the best way would be? I have a tame sparky that will happily look at the wiring when I've finished to check it's safe.

[1 2many]

Looking forward to your build mate you have a nice collection of goodies there. :dance:

Inspire me. :D

[rumdidlydum]

. The only exception is I'll be running the SCR controller through a power meter to get a bit of feedback what's going on
Just a tip don't wire the monitors after the scr you want it before...
Otherwise the electrical magic disappears and you will be pissed :D
Also definitely put the fan in :handgestures-thumbupleft:

[warramungas]

. The only exception is I'll be running the SCR controller through a power meter to get a bit of feedback what's going on
Just a tip don't wire the monitors after the scr you want it before...
Otherwise the electrical magic disappears and you will be pissed :D
Also definitely put the fan in :handgestures-thumbupleft:

Cheers. Noted and will be done. Think I might put a switch in for the fan. No point running it for the stc 1000.
Thanks.
Warra

[scythe]

So the flow of electricity to your elements during a normal run goes;
From the power point through power meter to potentiometer which controls the voltage going into the SSR and finally into the element, yes?

[rumdidlydum]

So the flow of electricity to your elements during a normal run goes;
From the power point through power meter to potentiometer which controls the voltage going into the SSR and finally into the element, yes?

:handgestures-thumbupleft: thats it

[scythe]

Follow up question then.
Why does your SSR have a 3-32v DC input (on the sticker ) if you will be giving it 0-240v AC?
Does it matter?

Looking at ebay you can DC-AC, DC-DC and AC-AC SSRs for really cheap which makes me suspicious, it must matter or the chinese don't know what they are trying to sell

[rumdidlydum]

Signal voltage is 3 to 32v. :handgestures-thumbupleft:
Maybe you should start another thread so we can keep this one on track for warra :think:

[brewman]

So the flow of electricity to your elements during a normal run goes;
From the power point through power meter to potentiometer which controls the voltage going into the SSR and finally into the element, yes?

Sorry to continue the thread drift but it's a big fat NO on this one. The pot that controls the relay is a completely different circuit to the power flow. 240V should never get near it.

[warramungas]

Follow up question then.
Why does your SSR have a 3-32v DC input (on the sticker ) if you will be giving it 0-240v AC?
Does it matter?

Looking at ebay you can DC-AC, DC-DC and AC-AC SSRs for really cheap which makes me suspicious, it must matter or the chinese don't know what they are trying to sell

The 3 to 32 volt input is for the pid controller. 240 volt goes in/out on the other side is my understanding. I'm not sure of the wiring exactly but I'll spend some time with the leccy tonight before I start to cut and shut the wires.
Warra

[scythe]

Yeah my bad, it has started to drift away from the point.
I thought the power flowed accross the ssr.
There must be some electronic jiggery-pokery under that shell.

[1 2many]

Yeah they are switched by an optical switch so the input side of the ssr is electrically isolated from the live 240 volt terminal. :handgestures-thumbupleft:

[warramungas]

Talked to the sparky. Managed to confuse him pretty well I think with my story about using it to mash grain but he took one look and said "Its for a still isn't it?" Apparently he does a bit too. :))
He uses an urn with a simmerstat but I just don't think a simmerstat would be a very accurate method or control to vapour temp imho. Plus the thought of moving parts turns me off a bit.
I managed to get some advice and enough 4 mm cable to wire it all up roughly anyway. Will start the build tomorrow night as I'm too r@#ted at the moment to go wiring stuff up or cutting holes that need to be fairly precise. Will have the pleasure of hacksawing holes in the box if I can't find a jigsaw.

[620rossco]

control to vapour temp imho

We do realise this is not possible right?
Looking forward to seeing how it comes together. :handgestures-thumbupleft:

[warramungas]

control to vapour temp imho

We do realise this is not possible right?
Looking forward to seeing how it comes together. :handgestures-thumbupleft:

Aaaah, nightshift. The ability to post at 3 in the morning.

Why is it not possible? My PDA has its temp probe recessed directly under the collection tray. No liquid is able to collect in there but it can measure the overall temp of the vapour in the 2" gap between packing and the tray. The liquid condensed in the tray would be slightly lower again (I would have thought).
Have I got the theory wrong?
Warra

[scythe]

It is possible but it will not give you a stable boil.
Your still will surge and you will have to constantly make corrections to maintain the slow output we aim for to get the high quality we strive for.

[Sam.]

Yet another great thread from the newbies corner that gets overlooked.

viewtopic.php?f=57&t=3541

[warramungas]

Yet another great thread from the newbies corner that gets overlooked.

http://www.aussiedistiller.com.au/viewt ... =57&t=3541

Thanks for that Sam. Think I've read that already.
I understand specific and latent heat theory well enough. I must have my understanding of the column control system messed up somewhere. With this build I'll hook into tonight, I'll have a shiny new PID temp controller with a K type thermocouple to control a temperature somewhere.
The STC will hopefully only be used for mashing (and a backup) and the SCR doesn't bother to look at temperature, just controls power.
Where in a reflux or a bubbler would you position the PID probe for maximum effect and what would you be measuring?
I had planned to only use the SCR for pot stilling to control the rate on spirit runs or could I use the PID in some way for the same job?
Cheers, :handgestures-thumbupleft:
Warra

[P3T3rPan]

none of the 5 sparkies I have talked to understood that I wanted to control the power not the temperature. :-B
Their knowledge basically ends at the hot water thermostat(why is that not what you need they all chimed) :scared-eek:
What they do understand is what a Variac is and introducing this to the conversation sometimes wakes them up to what we are trying to achieve
(they get pissed that this plumber understands something to do with electrickery that they do not)

[Sam.]

I wouldn't put a PID probe anywhere in a bubbler.

I would run it how it' wants to run.

But that's just me ;-)