Reflux column as pot still

Pot still design and discussion

Reflux column as pot still

Postby moonmouse » Fri Dec 02, 2016 8:22 am

Appolagies in advance if this has been covered... I've read other topics similar and where mac has said you can run your reflux with reflux cooling turned off. My question is I'm doing macs rum I was doing a stripping run yesterday on the first gen I've got a temp control box as I've got 2 elements 1x 2000w and 1x 3000w so given I can only safely draw around 15amps on my power outlet I monitor how much I'm drawing.... with both on and running at about 35% draws about 1400w
Anyway the main issue I encountered was my temp at the takeoff was sitting at around 90 degrees c and from normally running at 78 (reflux) was confused that I wasn't doing it right. No packing in the column. It seemed like at the start the vapour would be nearly at the takeoff point then drop back down the column... (feeling temp on column) even if I reduced the power down to 900w the temp stayed at 90
Once it started it was quite fast a steady stream.. and abv at parrot was around 65% Us this ok? Would a tall column be effecting how it's running and would thus effect how it would run when finally doing a spirit run? I understand the vapour will boil at a specific temp pendent on product ie ethinol 78 ect but haven't done pot still before ....
Should I not get concerned about temp as a lot of blokes tend to mainly watch output stream? And keep it at a toothpick size and let that determine run speed? Sorry again for the questions I'm trying to break into generations and letting flavours get through to the final product. Any pointers would be great I'll attach a pic if setup so it's easier.
Thanks guys in advance for any input :think: :handgestures-thumbupleft:
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Re: Reflux column as pot still

Postby moonmouse » Fri Dec 02, 2016 8:27 am

Rrrrrrrr how do I upload pic. It's saying file to big? It's only 1 pic off my iPhone?
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Re: Reflux column as pot still

Postby Zak Griffin » Fri Dec 02, 2016 8:50 am

Just screenshot the photo you're trying to upload (press home and lock button at the same time) and upload the screenshot :handgestures-thumbupleft:
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Re: Reflux column as pot still

Postby moonmouse » Fri Dec 02, 2016 11:36 am

wont let me even off screen shot??? Saying file too big over 1 MiB ??? ~x(

Trying off iPhone 6plus..
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Re: Reflux column as pot still

Postby moonmouse » Fri Dec 02, 2016 12:10 pm

[attachment=0]Image.png[/attachment]


Did this work??? Haha did off iCloud
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
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Re: Reflux column as pot still

Postby scythe » Fri Dec 02, 2016 8:38 pm

It does make sense that the temp is higher.
You don't have the high purity of ethanol that you would normally because you are no refluxing it back.
Water boils at 100*C, ethanol at 78*C so 65% should boil at 92*C (65% of the boiling temp differential is 14*C so add that to the boiling point of ethanol) ish...

This is why you cannot really control a still by temperature.
Its all about take off rate and %ABV, with a reflux still you take off as fast as you can while maintaining a %ABV, this rate will slow down as the run progresses because you are extracting the ethanol from solution and it will take more time to build back up to the %ABV you are wanting to extract (boil).
yes?

with no reflux you are just stripping everything out of the water as fast as you can, %ABV and temp don't really enter into it except as a way of measuring.
This is more about volume, 50L wash @ 10%ABV will have 5L of 100% ethanol "available" if you are extracting/taking off at 65% you could potentially get 8.25L @ 65% IF you spent the extra hours and power required to get the last 40% out of the wash (not many, if any do).
even then you could have about 7-8L of low wines at 65% to then water down to 40% to re-run.
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Re: Reflux column as pot still

Postby moonmouse » Fri Dec 02, 2016 8:46 pm

Cheers scythe yep makes sense I mainly control temp as I have a potential output of 5000w which is too much for my standard house wiring and also to slow it all down a bit to stop smeering
A fella on a fb page said it may also be a result of a low abv wash would that contribute? I've never run this set up like this so not used to running so fast.. when I do the spirit run I'm assuming I'll be able to slow it all down a bit and get the cuts sorted Cheers for your help :handgestures-thumbupleft:
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Re: Reflux column as pot still

Postby moonmouse » Fri Dec 02, 2016 8:51 pm

Oh And I only pulled around 3ltrs for about 25ltrs @ about average 50% stopped at 40% and shut it down. The wash had been left for about 5 weeks as I had to go away..... next generation didn't get going after a few hours (was a bit disappointed ) so I pitched another lot of yeast and she's off again.... this is my first attempt at macs rum trying to do 5 generations Learning haha Wanting to learn about letting flavours through....
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Re: Reflux column as pot still

Postby scythe » Fri Dec 02, 2016 9:34 pm

It could be low wash %ABV, but by taking SG and FG readings you can know what you have before you run it and what to expect.
A good pot with a good wash should give you 60-75%ABV up to 80%ABV if you have a taller column on it so the wash could have been ok as well.
You are only stripping it remember so %ABV is not so important, just that you get as much ethanol out as you can/be bothered to.
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Re: Reflux column as pot still

Postby bluc » Sat Dec 03, 2016 9:46 am

moonmouse wrote:Oh And I only pulled around 3ltrs for about 25ltrs @ about average 50% stopped at 40% and shut it down. The wash had been left for about 5 weeks as I had to go away..... next generation didn't get going after a few hours (was a bit disappointed ) so I pitched another lot of yeast and she's off again.... this is my first attempt at macs rum trying to do 5 generations Learning haha Wanting to learn about letting flavours through....

If you running as a pot for a strip run collect down to 20% , 40% in my opinion is way to high to stop on a strip run, that normally gives me 4.5-5l at 40% from 25l wash then do your spirit run with cuts I normally get about 1.7-1.9l at 75% I water back to 65% I average 2l at 65% on oak from 25l :handgestures-thumbupleft:
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Re: Reflux column as pot still

Postby moonmouse » Sat Dec 03, 2016 9:58 am

Cheers bluc yep could have gone longer I had to go out so though bugger it ....
I should just crank the power and run n it harder.. I was just a little hesitant as the temp was righ up.
Got 3ltrs for run... will go longer next time
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Re: Reflux column as pot still

Postby moonmouse » Sat Dec 03, 2016 11:59 am

Will do 5-6 generations and aim to get around 25ltrs of 40% for spirit run...
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Re: Reflux column as pot still

Postby Kenster » Sun Dec 04, 2016 5:54 pm

moon, i have the same prob with only one 15amp fuse in my garage, trying to run a 2kw and a 3kw.My mate the sparky reckons to run a fair quality extension lead from another point/circuit in yr house on the 2kw side (that way it will not draw too much load) and you can run both flat stick for the strip.
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Re: Reflux column as pot still

Postby JamieC » Sat Dec 24, 2016 7:31 pm

I don't see it as a problem anymore. I have a 1M reflux still that I can halve into a 500mm pot still with no stainless wool. With a temp controller wound back to 180V I can get 65% which is exactly what I want to put on oak. Maybe you've been kissed on the dick by an angel. I'm sure mine doesn't have the same flavour as those with a bubbler, but hopefully I will be able to compare soon.
Its all about suck it and see. There is no right or wrong with this hobby.
If it tastes good. Run with it.
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Re: Reflux column as pot still

Postby scythe » Sun Dec 25, 2016 8:24 am

A single strip run will never taste as good as a twice distilled product.
You run it slow on the spirit run to get better separation of the good stuff and minimise the unwanteds in the final product.
Then you dilute it back to barrel strength.
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Re: Reflux column as pot still

Postby JamieC » Mon Dec 26, 2016 6:41 pm

All my vodka is double distilled at 1M column length with full packing. CFW etc is done as strip then spirit run at 500mm length no packing. Gees I wish my bubbler would hurry up and appear.
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