Sweet Feed

all about mashing and fermenting grains

Sweet Feed

Postby BigRig » Fri Dec 24, 2021 4:12 pm

I started typing this with the intention of adding it to the "no mash required" thread as it does use yellow label angel yeast but after searching the forum for sweet feed, there wasnt much at all on the subject, for those who also frequent HD will have heard of sweet feed whisk(e)y though.

I thought i would start a sweet feed thread of sorts.

Firstly, I cannot find sweet feed in Australia so i will start by making my own sweet feed based on 2 blends I found and seeing which i prefer (there were literally 100s of variations).

Blend 1 was 1:1:1:1 of oats, corn, barley and wheat plus 10-12% molasses (by weight).

Blend 2 was the same except the wheat was omitted.

I also noticed in my searches the sweet feed whiskey recipes seem to be sugar washes with the grain for flavour, similar to BWKO.

I will be doing AG with no added sugar (except whats in molasses) with yellow angel yeast. I will split the collection and keep half white and oak 50/50 french/USA the other.

Would i add the molasses later to allow the enzymes time to work on the grain without being distracted ?


Batch 1
40L water
3.25kg each of oats, corn, barley, wheat
1.5L molasses
70g yeast

Batch 2
40L water
4.4kg each of oats, corn, barley
1.5L feed molasses
70g yeast

Any feedback welcome.
BigRig
 
Posts: 752
Joined: Sun Apr 07, 2019 1:29 pm
Location: Brisbane, QLD
equipment: FSD 4" Mac SSG, 50L Milk Can, 2 x 2400w elements, 35L Digiboil Boiler, Airstill.

Re: Sweet Feed

Postby RC Al » Fri Dec 24, 2021 5:28 pm

Nice man

Hmm might end up tasting like the nutri grain wash? not a bad thing, but would be interesting to compare
RC Al
Mentor
 
Posts: 1568
Joined: Mon Oct 23, 2017 4:58 pm
Location: Sunshine Coast Area
equipment: 3 plate 4" glasser
2" Potty

Re: Sweet Feed

Postby BigRig » Fri Dec 24, 2021 6:36 pm

Never made nutrigrain wash before.
Just read the ingredients of nutrigrain and its very similar except for the extra vitamins and crap added.

I will make a batch of nutrigrain wash to compare.
BigRig
 
Posts: 752
Joined: Sun Apr 07, 2019 1:29 pm
Location: Brisbane, QLD
equipment: FSD 4" Mac SSG, 50L Milk Can, 2 x 2400w elements, 35L Digiboil Boiler, Airstill.

Re: Sweet Feed

Postby bluc » Sat Dec 25, 2021 8:52 am

I reakon the angel will process it fine with mol in from start..look forward to the result. I wonder what a all grain nutrigrain would be like. Besides expensive .
bluc
Site Donor
 
Posts: 8967
Joined: Tue Apr 14, 2015 5:47 pm
Location: sunshine coast
equipment: 2" pot with 2" shotty 400mm long 5x 1/2" on a t500 boiler.
50l keg boiler 4" still mount 4" sight glass 1" drain..
4 plate 4" bubbler, 600mm packed section

Re: Sweet Feed

Postby BigRig » Sun Jan 09, 2022 12:05 pm

The experimenting has begun. I have put 3 ferments down with a slight variation from the OP but all are identical to stop confusion.

In a 60L fermenter i went for
4.5kg oats
4.5kg corn
4.5kg barley
1.5L molasses
70g angel yeast
1 tsp citric acid (i had no backset)
Fill to 54L

The smell and taste of this mash is damn good already and has a nice coffee colour.

I have a NGW on the go for comparison :handgestures-thumbupleft:
BigRig
 
Posts: 752
Joined: Sun Apr 07, 2019 1:29 pm
Location: Brisbane, QLD
equipment: FSD 4" Mac SSG, 50L Milk Can, 2 x 2400w elements, 35L Digiboil Boiler, Airstill.

Re: Sweet Feed

Postby Hawkeye » Mon Jan 10, 2022 6:55 am

Super interested to hear how this goes!

Isn’t sweet feed what we call ere in Australia horse muesli?
A lot of brand name horse muesli has a heap of extra stuff added to it, but I think generic muesli is just grain and molasses
What was at your local feed store?
Hawkeye
 
Posts: 94
Joined: Sun Apr 12, 2015 11:01 am
Location: Hobart
equipment: 4 inch, 4 bubble plate on a 50L keg with 500mm packed section.

Re: Sweet Feed

Postby BigRig » Mon Jan 10, 2022 7:56 am

All the horse muesli i saw either had what i wanted removed (oats, molasses) or extra stuff i didn't want added (lupins, lucerne, hay, pellets of some sort and/or vitamins).

My local feedstore didnt carry any of it, the closest they had was molasses oats. It was cheaper for me to buy the oats and molasses separate as i did.
BigRig
 
Posts: 752
Joined: Sun Apr 07, 2019 1:29 pm
Location: Brisbane, QLD
equipment: FSD 4" Mac SSG, 50L Milk Can, 2 x 2400w elements, 35L Digiboil Boiler, Airstill.

Re: Sweet Feed

Postby BigRig » Tue Feb 01, 2022 8:36 pm

I ran the first gen of this on the weekend.

From each fermenter i ended up with almost 40L of wash. I stripped first 2 washes down to 25ish% then combined with 20L of wash for a spirit run. Leftover wash will be added to 2nd gen.

I discarded fores then collected in 250ml cuts until i hit hearts then upped to 500ml, dropped back to 250mls for tails.

Tasting notes
1. Heads
2. Heads
3. Heads
4. Honey, caramel. Slight heads burn.
5. Same as 4 without the heads burn. Reminds me of caramel popcorn.
6. Molasses, licorice flavour. But unlike a Rum. No grain.
7. Same as 6
8. Grain flavour is starting to show up but very Subtle. Molasses still there and very rummy. I love rum.
9. Grain flavour coming over more & the molasses flavour is fading. Reminds me of a muesli bar
10. Same as 9.
11. Now all i can taste is the grain, no real corn flavour though. molasses has gone.
12. Much the same as 11.
13. Grain flavour has faded alot. reminds me of straw or hay. Almost flavourless.
14. The flavour is back but different. Very nice. Dry,  no sweetness. My notes simply say "grain grain grain".
15. Same as 14. More complex, interesting grain flavours.
16. Much the same as 15, but deeper darker grain flavour. Slight smokey (not sure how, i didnt use peat. guessing its the molasses showing up again).
17. Same as 16 with heaps of dark smokey flavour. Very pleasant, almost reminds me of bbq.
18. Deep, dark flavours. Bags of smoke but not peaty smoke (i hate peat). No wet dog yet but hint of tails "funk". Again not unpleasant but didnt make the cut. ( i have kept it separate though and thrown some dark USA oak in it to see what happens).

I kept jars 5-16 + some of 17. End result was a nice smokey grain flavour with a sweet but not sickly after taste, oats helped with mouth feel.

Wasnt any noticeable corn flavour but the sweetness from the molasses might've masked it.

2nd gen has been down for a couple days and had 10L backset added to each. This looks and smells even better than 1st gen.

Sitting at 63%abv. I haven't added any wood yet as i was undecided, should i go french, usa or mix ?
BigRig
 
Posts: 752
Joined: Sun Apr 07, 2019 1:29 pm
Location: Brisbane, QLD
equipment: FSD 4" Mac SSG, 50L Milk Can, 2 x 2400w elements, 35L Digiboil Boiler, Airstill.

Re: Sweet Feed

Postby BigRig » Sat Feb 05, 2022 5:58 pm

Couldn't decide which oak so i went heavy usa / medium french mix. A week in and the smokiness has dulled but new flavours have turned up from the oak. Early days but i can see this being my fave drop if it keeps progressing the way it has.

I will keep at it and update as i go.
Last edited by BigRig on Sat Feb 05, 2022 6:00 pm, edited 2 times in total.
BigRig
 
Posts: 752
Joined: Sun Apr 07, 2019 1:29 pm
Location: Brisbane, QLD
equipment: FSD 4" Mac SSG, 50L Milk Can, 2 x 2400w elements, 35L Digiboil Boiler, Airstill.

Re: Sweet Feed

Postby BigRig » Wed Feb 23, 2022 11:22 pm

I ran 2nd gen on the weekend and let it air for 4 days before blending and putting on oak tonight.

From 100L i did 2 x 40L strips then combined 20L low wines with remaining 20L wash for a 1.5 run.

I went a bit tighter on the cuts this time as i planned to keep some white. I finished with 8.25L @ 62.5% plus some feints. I used 1 american medium toast domino and 1 french medium toast domino in 5L.

While i was sampling and blending the new booze i had a Taste of 1st gen which has been on oak for 3 weeks, the flavours are more cohesive and the mouth feel has come on with the oats.

The funky smokey grain flavour i was trying to capture has almost all gone but this has been replaced with a better balanced flavour profile.

This is going to be really good and i am stoked.
BigRig
 
Posts: 752
Joined: Sun Apr 07, 2019 1:29 pm
Location: Brisbane, QLD
equipment: FSD 4" Mac SSG, 50L Milk Can, 2 x 2400w elements, 35L Digiboil Boiler, Airstill.

Re: Sweet Feed

Postby BigRig » Wed Jun 08, 2022 3:49 pm

Time for an update. This stuff is now 3 months old and has a nice grainy flavour, cannot really detect any molasses flavour though it is a little sweeter than a standard all grain, maybe that's all i will get.

Its still young but not sure if it's different enough to continue doing alongside BWKO which i like.
BigRig
 
Posts: 752
Joined: Sun Apr 07, 2019 1:29 pm
Location: Brisbane, QLD
equipment: FSD 4" Mac SSG, 50L Milk Can, 2 x 2400w elements, 35L Digiboil Boiler, Airstill.

Re: Sweet Feed

Postby The Stig » Wed Jun 08, 2022 4:44 pm

This is the style I’ll be trying with the Angel I’ve just ordered .
The Stig
Site Nerd
 
Posts: 18192
Images: 9
Joined: Sun Jun 19, 2011 8:37 am
equipment: Only the Best will Do.
Mac4 SSG Bubbles of Joy

Re: Sweet Feed

Postby Rumblepants » Tue Sep 13, 2022 8:14 am

hi BigRig

I made a sweet feed variant using Nutrigrain recipe and adding 800g of blackstrap molassses to it. Has been the nicest sugar head wash to date. I distilled it using the 1.5 method through a post still.

Have you seen this stuff. Is it cheaper to just buy avi grade corn and oats then add DAP and molasses to it?

https://www.sydneyequestriansupplies.co ... se&sz=&cl=

What do ya reckon?

Cheers
Rumble
Rumblepants
 
Posts: 82
Joined: Sat May 02, 2020 4:28 am
equipment: 2inch CCVM 50L Keg Boiler

Re: Sweet Feed

Postby RC Al » Tue Sep 13, 2022 10:21 pm

It may work, it might not, depends on how much salt and whatever else is in there that's not listed, you would have to get the full ingredient list to be sure.

Convenient way to buy it, but i personally wouldn't use it.

The $$ per kg is cheaper for regular grains, $19-25 a bag around here, but you would have to buy 80 kg of grain.

Also at that price, your halfway to using malts
RC Al
Mentor
 
Posts: 1568
Joined: Mon Oct 23, 2017 4:58 pm
Location: Sunshine Coast Area
equipment: 3 plate 4" glasser
2" Potty

Re: Sweet Feed

Postby BigRig » Tue Sep 13, 2022 11:44 pm

Rumblepants wrote:hi BigRig

I made a sweet feed variant using Nutrigrain recipe and adding 800g of blackstrap molassses to it. Has been the nicest sugar head wash to date. I distilled it using the 1.5 method through a post still.

Have you seen this stuff. Is it cheaper to just buy avi grade corn and oats then add DAP and molasses to it?

https://www.sydneyequestriansupplies.co ... se&sz=&cl=

What do ya reckon?

Cheers
Rumble


Hey mate yeah i did see that stuff and other similar stuff but like i said earlier in the thread and Al touched on, it has a bunch of other crap in it that i didn't want or know.

Price was better to do it like i did anyway, with the individual grains.

My stuff is almost 7 months old and i haven't sample, seen or smell this since my last update at 3 months.
BigRig
 
Posts: 752
Joined: Sun Apr 07, 2019 1:29 pm
Location: Brisbane, QLD
equipment: FSD 4" Mac SSG, 50L Milk Can, 2 x 2400w elements, 35L Digiboil Boiler, Airstill.

Re: Sweet Feed

Postby BigRig » Sat Sep 24, 2022 11:05 am

Time for an update. I had a couple samples with my neighbour and did a side by side with bwko and another creation. It is now 7 months old.

Based on my recipe (see the 5th post of the thread for the actual recipe i used, not the 1st post which were just me rambling) this stuff resembles a sweeter (but not sickly) grain bourbon and not a rum. I love rum but this is a nice change when you don't want a rum.

If you wanted it sweeter, you could ditch USA oak and use 100% french oak but I am happy with it as is.

I have never tried malted grain before so i might invest a bit extra $$$ and try it this season for comparison otherwise i wont change anything.

This stuff is really good and will be a regular for me whereas bwko won't be.

If you liked the bwko then you will definitely like this stuff.
BigRig
 
Posts: 752
Joined: Sun Apr 07, 2019 1:29 pm
Location: Brisbane, QLD
equipment: FSD 4" Mac SSG, 50L Milk Can, 2 x 2400w elements, 35L Digiboil Boiler, Airstill.

Re: Sweet Feed

Postby scythe » Sat Sep 24, 2022 2:20 pm

BigRig wrote:I love rum but this is a nice change when you don't want a rum.


Can you please talk through this strange feeling you get?
I don't think I've ever experienced this phenomenon.
scythe
 
Posts: 1860
Joined: Thu Nov 14, 2013 6:34 am
Location: Central West NSW
equipment: Dreaming of a 4" bubbler

Re: Sweet Feed

Postby BigRig » Mon Feb 27, 2023 11:55 pm

I bottled this stuff on the weekend at 13 months old. Wow it's good.
BigRig
 
Posts: 752
Joined: Sun Apr 07, 2019 1:29 pm
Location: Brisbane, QLD
equipment: FSD 4" Mac SSG, 50L Milk Can, 2 x 2400w elements, 35L Digiboil Boiler, Airstill.

Re: Sweet Feed

Postby murrumfatboy » Thu Mar 21, 2024 2:24 pm

Question on starch conversion - noting that I am going to be using equal parts cracked corn, oats, and malted barley (Atlas), do I need to do anything weird or different to get the best out of the corn. Going off the theory of maximum fermentability (from an AG brewer perspective), I was going to go 50/65/72/78 for temps. If I put them all in together, will there be any issues, or do I need to treat the corn differently?
Been doing lots of reading and getting more confused....
murrumfatboy
 
Posts: 4
Joined: Mon Jan 15, 2024 12:53 pm
Location: Murrumbateman, NSW
equipment: Alcoengine Pot Still

Re: Sweet Feed

Postby chipboy » Thu Mar 21, 2024 4:10 pm

Leave the Barley out, its malt is there to convert the starches you release and it is denatured going above about 68. Note there is alpha amalayse and bet amalayse, beta works at a lower term than alpha and will be harmed the most.

Best to is balance it out and add at 65C on the way down with temperatures. This way they will both do their thing and convert starch to sugars.

Grinding and particle size are another matter as is duration to fully gelatinise.
chipboy
 
Posts: 238
Joined: Sun Apr 05, 2020 3:56 pm
equipment: 50 litre keg, insulated and 4 plates at 4 inch.

Next

Return to The Mash tun



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 13 guests

x