Choosing Packed Section & Packing

[NFI]

Hi All
I have a 4 plate FSD 4" bubbler and I am at that point of wanting to invest in a packed section and am looking for any advise as well as answers to a couple of questions.
As the price difference between the 250mm and 500mm pack section kits are not worlds apart I gather from an economic point of view it is more about the packing than the actual upgrade.
I also would not want to put in a 250mm and then think it could be better product if I just went the whole hog with 500mm. I know people on the forum are getting good results using the 250mm - is 500 overkill or is 250 a compromise?
From what I have read a 1Kg $85 roll of FSD copper is sufficient to fill only 100mm of the secton (in a jam you can put 75g in the bottom and the rest up top) it would therefore cost up to $425 in copper to fill the entire section which has been stated many times that it would be over kill. My intent would be to use a minnimum of 1KG of copper, unsure of the rest.
For the rest my options as I understand it are
1.) SS scrubbers (if some one could give me a link to the preferred ones that would be appriciated) - roughly how many would be required to fill to remaining 400mm of section.
2.) Scoria - cleaned and boiled
3.) Marbles??
I have also been looking at
4.) Graded fire glass
5.) Pumice (if I could find it in 8-10mm grading - atleast it is a bit lighter than the scoria but I donot know how well it would hold up to the process)
Other suggestions to research welcome.
**Comments and corrections welcome

Specific questions
1.) What is the life expectancy of the roll of copper?
2.) Roughly how long is a a 1Kg (100mm) roll of copper?
3.) Does the entire area in the section have to filled (obviously it wont work as well)
4.) It seems to be common that people use either copper + SS or copper + scoria but then I see other comments (for example -

Search the forum for scoria.
Lots have used it with differing results.
Don’t break it up too small , probably around 5mm - 7mm in size.
Wash thoroughly.
Do not mix reflux material, different media reflux’s at different rates and will cause havoc with the system

)
about it being bad to mix different packing - can I get some clarification on this?

I am looking forward to ordering my packed section (once I can make up my mind) and comparing it to the product I was originally getting with just the 4 plates.
If I can get some good/in depth responses on this thread it could help a lot of people down the track.

[BigRig]

Best bet would be to ring Andrew about the copper packing in a 500mm section, he has it at his disposal and can test it, though i am sure he probably has 100s of times before and can confirm.

1kg per roll for the 100mm height doesnt sound right. My 1kg roll, rolled tightly i could never fit in a 4" pipe. I used to use 120grams per roll in a 2" pipe (boka) and it gave me 800mm of packing with a little bit left over. If you were to double it to 250g per roll for 4" that would give you 4 rolls (400mm) of packing.

I would go the copper over the other packing options. It will be lighter and you can never have too much copper in the still.

[BigRig]

To answer your other question, if you have the head room and $$$$ go for the 500mm section straight up. You are better to have it and not need it, than need it and not have it.

You dont necessarily need to pack the whole section.

[bluc]

I wouldnt go below 500mm, mine is 600mm. 250mm from my viewpoint is its easier to lift 250mm of scoria copper stainless wool then 500mm..

[The Stig]

A 500mm section will take 4 x 500g rolls

[RC Al]

I'll add my usual 2c worth of as much height as it takes to just miss your roof...

[dazzerthemighty]

I'll add my usual 2c worth of as much height as it takes to just miss your roof...

isn't that what the man hole is for in the ceiling?
:laughing-rolling:

[FatManDancing]

I too looked at scoria and marbles. While scoria is cheap and marbles are expensive and since I will be running over four copper plates anyway I chose to go the stainless scrubber route. Sabco three pack for $6.90 from the big green shed

Biggest reason is cost but also how easy are they to clean. Just chuck em in the dish washer

I have a modular packed section. I can run at 300mm or 600mm. Four scrubbers per section


How well does that work? I am sorry I can not say. I have spent most of my weekends this year mashing wheat and collecting low wines for a big vodka run. The last 150L is fermenting now.

If you are prepared to wait I can do a spirit run with one packed section and compare it with two but if not I would go the larger column

[NFI]

Thanks for everyones input.

From what I can ascertain the copper should last a number of years without needing to be replaced if treated properly and so I think it will be the full 500mm with 2Kgs of copper.
Just for the hell of it I might get some SS scrubbers down the track and try going half and half and see if I can pick a difference and report back. I hunted through the forum for guidance on this topic without much success so hopefully this can help others make their choice. So anyone wanting to add there experiments and findings that would be great.

Cheers

[The Stig]

I might get some SS scrubbers down the track and try going half and half

Not a good idea to mix and match reflux media.
Different surface areas will reflux at different ratios and cause havoc in the packed column

[NFI]

I might get some SS scrubbers down the track and try going half and half

Not a good idea to mix and match reflux media.
Different surface areas will reflux at different ratios and cause havoc in the packed column

:text-thankyoublue: Thanks Stig for confirmng that in this thread, it seems comon place on this forum for people to specify that they are using a combination of reflux medium in their stills.
Given that you are someone who's knowledge on FSD equipment and it's useage is second to none on this forum others will accept it more as gospel coming from you rather than me.
More crutial info such as this that we can get all together in the one thread the better for all future forum users.

Maybe at some stage then I will remove all the copper packing and give it a run on apacked section completely filled with different media and report back in time.

[2deadly.308]

Definitely go the 500mm over the 250mm provided your distilling area has the head room.

I looked at getting scoria but ended up just using the SS scrubbies from.Bunnings. They seem to work fine. Mainly just went with them ober scoria as I couldn't be bothered washing the scoria, even though it would have been the cheaper option.

[RuddyCrazy]

just be bery careful with SS scrubbers from the big green shed, grab a magnet and see if it sticks to the scrubbers and if it does use em for cleaning NOT packing. now SS is non magnetic and by simply using a magnet can tell if it is or isn't

[The Stig]

just be bery careful with SS scrubbers from the big green shed, grab a magnet and see if it sticks to the scrubbers and if it does use em for cleaning NOT packing. now SS is non magnetic and by simply using a magnet can tell if it is or isn't

I have to agree with Bryan ( first for everything)
I’ve seen some nasty rust clumps come out of still when they were supposedly packed with stainless scrubbers

[BigRig]

Take a magnet with you to bunnings and check before you buy them :handgestures-thumbupleft:

[2deadly.308]

just be bery careful with SS scrubbers from the big green shed, grab a magnet and see if it sticks to the scrubbers and if it does use em for cleaning NOT packing. now SS is non magnetic and by simply using a magnet can tell if it is or isn't

Well suprise suprise, turns out the SS scrubbers I got from Bunnings aren't actually SS.

The metal is magnetic and they've left a shit load of orange rust all through my bubble plates.

What the actual fuck?

On the packet it says 'stainless steel' and literally says 'won't rust'.

Every day I understand more and more why my father left me as a kid, but god damn, I feel like a stupid c*** right now.

Surely they have to refund me for this?

Absolutely pissed off right now.

For others as a warning, this was the scrubbies in the pack of 8 or 10, not the 3 pack ones.