Help making Vodka

[Blythy]

Hello,

I apologize but I have no idea where I am going wrong so and have followed guides but I dont know the right question to ask.

I started my 1st attempt at distilling today, I am using a DigiBoil which was running at 100 degrees with the Thermometer at 79 degrees and my 1st 50ml of product came out at 89%.
After this point the Thermometer temp starting rising and stabilized at 98 degrees with my product them dropping to 75%.

I dont know what happened or how this happens.

My Process,

32L Stainless Steel Conical Fermenter: Filled with 6kg of Sugar and top up with a mix of boiling water and cold water to 23L, mixing so the sugar dissolves.
Once temperature drops to 25 degrees so not to kill yeast I added 5g of Lalvin EC-1118 yeast and a teaspoon of Yeast Nutrient.
I then put a heat belt set to 25 degrees around my Fermenter and a jacket to ensure temperature is maintained.
I let it sit for a 9 days, about 3 days in the plastic thing on top was raising and going back down which I believe means it was going through its process.

Using the Tap I emptied my product into my 32L DigiBoil, leaving the crud and about 300 mills of stuff at the bottom that is under the tap level.
I hooked up my 40m hose to my 1100w water pump which goes to my water tank for the water supply. Attached my 1 mil fitting and set it up for vodka to drip into my parrot with alcohol gauge.
Once my Thermeter Temp reached 78 and stayed there I opened up the nozzle and began collecting until what i said at the start of the post happened.

I followed the videos and guides but must have got something wrong, any help would be much appreciated.

Thanks

[MarkChap]

Hi Blythy,
What brand or make/model of still are you using ?
This will help the knowledgeable peoples give you some answers

Seems strange that you only got 50ml before the temp rose so much and ABV dropped

[Blythy]

Hello,

I am using a Digi Boil and MKII Temperature Controller both from KegLand

[MarkChap]

That's your boiler and controller, what still, the part on top of the boiler,
I guess you will be using the Kegland Alcoengine

I am sure some knowledgeable people will be along soon

Hello,

I am using a Digi Boil and MKII Temperature Controller both from KegLand

[The Stig]

To start with you need a better recipe .
Sugar water and yeast isn’t a great start even with a yeast nutrient .
EC1118 is not the best yeast either , it’s an extremely slow champagne yeast not a great distilling yeast (it does have a place)
Try one of the proven recipes such as WBAB or TFFV
And now there is the Digiboil , not a great unit , all compromise .
But your running it way too fast , sounds like a stripping run.
And , we need to know what column you have ? If it’s a pot still it sounds right , if a reflux as I said above , your running way too fast

[The Stig]

Oh and by the way , it’s normally courteous to drop into the welcome centre to introduce yourself as a first post .

[howard]

too much sugar, wrong yeast, wrong videos (probably) :smile:
don't worry, it gets better :?

[Wellsy]

Hello Blythy
Just to clarify are you using a mk11 temp controller, or is it actually a power controller ?
if it is a temp controller as you said it will not be helping at all. The trick to distilling is to control the boil by varying the power going to the heating elements. I temp controller simply turns to power off. In simple terms it is like trying to keep a kettle at 85 degrees by simply turning the power on and off. Theoretically possible just not achievable.
I Have seen the video that says you can set and forget a still using one of these unfortunately as you have discovered the results are not good

[Blythy]

Afternoon,

Again thanks for the replies,

@MarkChap, Sorry I misunderstood but yes i am using the Gen2 - Alcoengine - Copper reflux Still with hose quick disconnects.

@The Stig, Ill post a intro post (Sorry) My still is as above.
What do you mean by too fast? I followed the guide on what temp to have it but dont understand how I then slow it down?
You said the Yeast Wash I was going was not the best, I was reading an interesting Tomato Paste Wash from this forum is that one a good one to try?

@Wellsy, MKII Temp Controller I at first had this controlling the power but changed it as like you said it was just turning off and on all the time and doing nothing. So I ended up plugging the Digiboil directly into the power and only using the MKII Temp Controller to measure the temp.

So are we thinking my wash is the issues and in a nut just no good? If so The Stig posted 2 other washes to try and I read a Tomato Paste Wash from these forums. Which one is the most beginner friendly?

Thanks

[RuddyCrazy]

To make life easier for you mate now lets say you have a 60 litre fermenter invert 10 kg's of sugar, meaning warm up some water in a pot to say 60C then dump in 2kg's of sugar and mix until it's all clear then dump a second one in (providing the pot is big enough) :laughing-rolling: then pitch it straight into your fermenter which roughly the same amount of cold water, then when all the sugar is inverted grab a small box of weetbix and a jar of Lowans Baking yeast form the supermarket. Just crunch up the weetbix and throw it straight in the wash give a good stir with a paint mixer and if you did the hot to cold water right the temp should be a tad over 30C :handgestures-thumbupleft:

Then just sprinkle on some baking yeast and once again give it a good mix with a paint mixer as we want to get some oxygen into the wash so the yearties can get a good start. Now if do like oysters save the shells and throw one in each wash as they are a real good ph buffer.

Cheers Bryan

[The Stig]

Get one of these : https://5stardistilling.com/product/pow ... 00w-10amp/
By plugging the boiler into this you will be able to slow down the run.
On the Digiboil , set the temp to 105 deg and run the power controller full untill boiling then dial back the power to run the still slower .
Less power means the boiler is boiling less rapidly allowing the column to run slower giving you more control and a better product .
Some people like the TPW , personally I don’t , I much prefer the WBAB or TFFV

[Wellsy]

:text-+1:
To both the power controller and the Wheat Bix All Bran recipe in the tried and tested recipes

[Blythy]

Hello,

Again thanks for all your help guys. I feel like I have learned more in less time from here than the videos I have watched.
I will purchase a controller as you suggested to enable me to better control it.

I have also posted a picture of my set up.

My current mixture:
1. Do we believe the mixture is no good as well and do I need to throw it out?

New Wash
2. With my 32L Stainless Steel Fermenter having no way to see inside how do I know it has worked as intended before starting the Distilling process?

General Question
3. When do you stop Distilling? I am finding to many post/videos out there with different information some say when it drops below 85% strength other say collect until 60% and other says once the temp will not longer stabilize between 77 and 80.

WBAB, alright so this is what I will go with next and I have read through the 32 pages of comments.......
4. So once i follow this recipe and let it sit for a day with the lid un secured, It mentions that it takes 1 to 2 weeks to ferment and you know its done once it stops Bubbling and goes clear but as I cant see inside my Fermenter how do you guys know this? Are you allowed to open it? From what I read you arnt suppose to.
5. A lot of recipes mention stripping, just want to confirm that this is not required but something that just gives you a better end product and something I can worry about once I can actually get an end product.

Thanks and again I appreciate all the help, I just want to get an end product as I followed a guide and purchased everything recommend and put in the effort only to have it fail and just dont want to spend the next 2-3 weeks and get the same result.

[The Stig]

With all respect , the very first thing you need to do now that your here is take a deep breath and slow down.
I’ll let one of our mentors take over and lead you through the steps , I get enough of that from commercial guys

[Wellsy]

Gidday Michael
1 you know it is worked off 2 different ways , you can use your hydrometer and I would expect it to read anywhere from 0.00 to -.990. No need to stress if you dont have one simply stick your finger in the wash and taste it. It will have a slight bitterness to it and it will not be sweet. If you taste it when you first pitch the yeast it will be sticky and sweet. Sweetness and stickiness disappears as the sugar gets eaten. You cannot always rely on the plastic bubble device ( air lock ) as this can give you a false reading.

2. many of the comments about not opening the fermenter is all about not infecting the wash or not letting oxygen into the mix once it has started. This is very much a beer centric thing as beer is far more fussy about fermentation than spirit is. In fact some washes benefit from an infection but that is another rabbit hole :). It is fine to take off the lid and look taste, just dont stir it or agitate it.

3. It really depends on what you are doing. I go with stripping and then a spirit run and it makes makes the cuts easier for me as they are more defined. Tripping runs I just let it run until the output at the spout is around 15% - 20% as this usually gives me an average of 40%. The spirit run I just keep going and collect in 300 ml cuts, let it air over night then do the taste test. It is a real advantage to get a syringe to be able to dilute small amounts of your cuts. Re read the cuts section in the newbie section.

4 if you keep the temp controlled the WBAB wash will definitely be worked off in 2 weeks assuming all things are the same. I have only ever had 1 wash fail and that was because the town decided to clean the water pipes that week and it had heaps of chlorine in it.

Videos are great to see different techniques but the information in them are not always accurate. Have a good read of the newbies section, and then read it again. It makes more sense everytime you read it. Always always make sure you have time to do what you want to do. We had a member who lived near me who could not get his washes to work off. I paid him a visit and it turned out he was always rushing and never had time to let the wash cool to the right temp before pitching the yeast. Spirit washes are fairly forgiving but you still have to show them some love :)

Hope that helps

[WoodyD40]

Hello,

Again thanks for all your help guys. I feel like I have learned more in less time from here than the videos I have watched.
I will purchase a controller as you suggested to enable me to better control it.

I have also posted a picture of my set up.

My current mixture:
1. Do we believe the mixture is no good as well and do I need to throw it out?

New Wash
2. With my 32L Stainless Steel Fermenter having no way to see inside how do I know it has worked as intended before starting the Distilling process?

General Question
3. When do you stop Distilling? I am finding to many post/videos out there with different information some say when it drops below 85% strength other say collect until 60% and other says once the temp will not longer stabilize between 77 and 80.

WBAB, alright so this is what I will go with next and I have read through the 32 pages of comments.......
4. So once i follow this recipe and let it sit for a day with the lid un secured, It mentions that it takes 1 to 2 weeks to ferment and you know its done once it stops Bubbling and goes clear but as I cant see inside my Fermenter how do you guys know this? Are you allowed to open it? From what I read you arnt suppose to.
5. A lot of recipes mention stripping, just want to confirm that this is not required but something that just gives you a better end product and something I can worry about once I can actually get an end product.

Thanks and again I appreciate all the help, I just want to get an end product as I followed a guide and purchased everything recommend and put in the effort only to have it fail and just dont want to spend the next 2-3 weeks and get the same result.

Blythy

I have the 65 litre version of that boiler, and have/had the same reflux on top of it (now retired).

What I found was that the boiler only needs to be at 1500w or 2000w MAX for the whole system to work - I think for the smaller boiler you have, 1500w is more than enough. (thats without using a power controller - but I've learnt that using power control is a far superior control method than just turning on/off the different heating elements)
Boiler temp (if the fermentation is good - aka 11 to 125 abv) I would start getting good vapour in the low to mid 90's. By the time the boiler got to 99% you can almost guarantee your dont have any good quality alcohol coming out any more and you are most likely in Tails.
I had the coolant water slowed down from the Reflux so that it come out in a slow stream (down to about 6 to 9 litres per minute) and would be only slightly warm to touch.
The distillate would come out in a very constant drip - and until i came to tails, it would usually be in the low to mid 90% ABV (the finish result usually at about 92%).

The Reflux column temp would be at 79 degrees, and would slowly rise until 80% ( I used a digital gauge ) - by then the boiler was at 99deg and i stopped collecting distillate.

[howard]

2. With my 32L Stainless Steel Fermenter having no way to see inside how do I know it has worked as intended before starting the Distilling process?

General Question
3. When do you stop Distilling? I am finding to many post/videos out there with different information some say when it drops below 85% strength other say collect until 60% and other says once the temp will not longer stabilize between 77 and 80.

WBAB, alright so this is what I will go with next and I have read through the 32 pages of comments.......
4. So once i follow this recipe and let it sit for a day with the lid un secured, It mentions that it takes 1 to 2 weeks to ferment and you know its done once it stops Bubbling and goes clear but as I cant see inside my Fermenter how do you guys know this? Are you allowed to open it? From what I read you arnt suppose to.
5. A lot of recipes mention stripping, just want to confirm that this is not required but something that just gives you a better end product and something I can worry about once I can actually get an end product.

Thanks and again I appreciate all the help, I just want to get an end product as I followed a guide and purchased everything recommend and put in the effort only to have it fail and just dont want to spend the next 2-3 weeks and get the same result.

2) it is ok to look into the fermenter as the air given off is carbon dioxide, heavier than air, just try not to fiddle around too much (or stir).
a simple hydrometer will tell you the SG, but after it does stop bubbling, there is some cleanup work for the yeasties to perform.
the SS fermenter is a nice piece of kit, but down the line you will probably need more fermenters.
just having one fermenter will be frustrating, especially as you should go down the strip run & spirit run path.
i do 4 x 25L ferments (usually 2 at a time) and strip these 4 washes , that gives me a full boiler for the spirit run.
i use 30L MJ fermenters with no tap outlet so they are easy to clean and stack when not in use.
https://homebrew-hq.com.au/product/fermenter-30l-pail-mj/

also, if you get the bug and have the space, i use cheap fridges for my fermenting cabinets with Inkbird controllers.
i buy all-fridge or all-freezer from gumtree/faecesbook and can get 2/3 of the MJ tubs in at once.(that SS is quite tall)

i doubt that you will get a decent end product unless you strip first.
you can always re-run stuff if you're not happy, i re-ran a heap of my first attempts once i got the hang of it.
i am also a fan of the FFV, wasn't keen on TPW.

[Blythy]

SUCCESS!!!!

I apologize for bringing back an old thread but just wanted to say thanks for everyone's help in the above post.

I went and purchased the equipment recommended, also followed the 23L WBAB wash as also recommended.
Ended up with 2.5L at 90% ABV before the ABV started slowly dropping.

I will ask 1 more questions if people done mind, Once it starts dropping do people still collect more (I am using it to mix into cocktails) and how much more good quality alcohol do people still get if they continue?

Thanks

[Wellsy]

Congrats Blythy
You ended up with 2.5 ltrs of drinkable product after cuts ?
Or did you end up with 2.5 litres and you made no cuts and simply relied on the ABV.

I have not used gear like yours mate so can only guess an answer about continuing. If you are making cuts then it is probably worthwhile as it will add the output next time.

If you are not making cuts all I can say is read the section on cuts in the newbie section mate as it will open up your world :)

[WoodyD40]

Congrats Blythy
You ended up with 2.5 ltrs of drinkable product after cuts ?
Or did you end up with 2.5 litres and you made no cuts and simply relied on the ABV.

I have not used gear like yours mate so can only guess an answer about continuing. If you are making cuts then it is probably worthwhile as it will add the output next time.

If you are not making cuts all I can say is read the section on cuts in the newbie section mate as it will open up your world :)

:text-+1: for what Wellsy wrote

I use small glass jars at approx 250ml each. After the spirit run is finished, with all the jars lined up i start smelling from the middle and work towards the first jars, and stop once the smell changes to acetone. Then i go back to middle and start smelling towards the end of the run - and separate once the smell starts being off again (its likened to be like wet cardboard/or wet fur from a pet). If unsure i sometime dip a finger in and do a taste test - but only a drop or two as a test of a couple of jars where i think the change might occur.

Another rule of thumb that seems to work with the WBAB wash that i use and i am dumping over 50l into my 65l boiler is, the first jar is four shots and next 3 jars are heads (approx 1 litre by that stage), next 4 litres is good as hearts (this i keep) then the final litre is certainly tails. So i collect 6 litres, but only keep 4 litres.
I also turn off the boiler once it reaches 99 degrees, i am absolutely into tails by that time. The trick is to ensure the temp at the top of that reflux column does not go above 80 degrees, that when the ABV drops off quickly too.