Aeration

Discuss everything about oaking and aging here

Re: Aeration

Postby 1 2many » Thu Oct 31, 2013 4:47 pm

Ok another curve ball , what if we held the distillate at say 10-12 deg and aerated with warmer air eg: 35- 60 or what ever deg to help isolate the good bits from the bad bits. :-B
1 2many
Site Donor
 
Posts: 4212
Joined: Sun Jan 27, 2013 6:08 am
Location: Where the sun shines
equipment: Portable A.G brewery ,#001 5 STAR blockhead 4" Modular 4 plate SSG with,6"inline thumper, 2.5" 9 tube shotgun, packed section, Boiler 50 ltr inverted keg 4"still mount, 2.4 Kw FSD elements 1"drain.

Re: Aeration

Postby Yummyrum » Thu Oct 31, 2013 5:14 pm

1 2many wrote:Ok another curve ball , what if we held the distillate at say 10-12 deg and aerated with warmer air eg: 35- 60 or what ever deg to help isolate the good bits from the bad bits. :-B


Recon you might need some kind of fridge setup to hold it at that temp,with all that hot air blowing through it,the distillate would heat up really quickly I'd imagine
Yummyrum
 
Posts: 1897
Joined: Fri Dec 28, 2012 3:19 pm
Location: Near Coffs
equipment: Did use Still Spirits Reflux
Now use 50l Keg with Pot head for Rum and Neutral stripping runs on gas .
LM/VM head with 1m packed 2" on Still Spirits boiler for Neutrals.

Re: Aeration

Postby 1 2many » Thu Oct 31, 2013 5:23 pm

Yummyrum wrote:
1 2many wrote:Ok another curve ball , what if we held the distillate at say 10-12 deg and aerated with warmer air eg: 35- 60 or what ever deg to help isolate the good bits from the bad bits. :-B


Recon you might need some kind of fridge setup to hold it at that temp,with all that hot air blowing through it,the distillate would heat up really quickly I'd imagine


Yes yummy it would need refrigeration of some type , maybe I can brew lagers while i age my spirit in my moded kelvinator in the shed . :D
1 2many
Site Donor
 
Posts: 4212
Joined: Sun Jan 27, 2013 6:08 am
Location: Where the sun shines
equipment: Portable A.G brewery ,#001 5 STAR blockhead 4" Modular 4 plate SSG with,6"inline thumper, 2.5" 9 tube shotgun, packed section, Boiler 50 ltr inverted keg 4"still mount, 2.4 Kw FSD elements 1"drain.

Re: Aeration

Postby Pugdog1 » Mon Nov 04, 2013 12:43 pm

Hi guys few questions

What are u all using to cover the tops of demijohns?
And could I use a bung with a hole in it instead and feed the bubble through that?
How much do u lose to evaporation?
And what is the best avg time to do it for or is it all trial n error?

Cheers pug
Pugdog1
 
Posts: 158
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2013 2:56 pm
equipment: Still spirits Turbo 500 still

Re: Aeration

Postby bt1 » Mon Nov 04, 2013 6:19 pm

Howdy,

can't speak for demijohns specifically as using 19lt SS post mixers. I use the same idea however, lid on no seal and a 5/8" hole with aeration leg through that.

regardless of what you use you need to accept some loss. I've tried re condensing the vapours and it truly is cat's piss.

I loss about 1 - 1.5lt in a 19lt keg. It's ambient temp related so reckon above 25c days...best done at night when cooler...Doc recommended a timer on air pump...smart!

Time seems to depend on avg from what I've seen... it basically equals out but the flavour is vasty diff...goes like this for mine...

65 abv... higher rate of loss, but remaining when cut to drinking strength is a better aged at I reckon 1.5 -2.5 days so 30 days treatment = up to 75 days equivalent age ...does still need timber time post this to fully develop but timber uptake seem fairly rapid.

40 abv lower rate of loss, tends to accentuate the tails when done and requires more post treatment timber time...max would be 1.5 days so 30 days treatment taste like 45 day old...roughly..

You'll notice the effect from as little as a week. The effect seems reasonably constant over AG washes, UJSM's, Irish blends, Ryes, sugarhead/grain variations.

It has bugger all to offer neutrals imho...it goes tails up imho.

For rums gains seem minimal I suspect because it genuinely takes time to turn remaining molasses flavour pull through.

bt1
bt1
 
Posts: 2448
Joined: Sun Apr 22, 2012 11:56 am
Location: Adelaide
equipment: 2 x Glass Bubblers, 5 plate 89mm & 6 plate 110mm
4" 6 plate copper bubbler, 500mm copper packed section
Several pots, custom boiler
14 keg rotating brew setup, fermentation & dispenser fridges.

Re: Aeration

Postby TheMechwarrior » Mon Jul 21, 2014 3:02 pm

Damn great thread that's been a bit quiet of late.

Here's a link to some air pumps and specs that some might find helpful:
Image

Cheers,

Mech.
TheMechwarrior
 
Posts: 1006
Joined: Mon Dec 05, 2011 1:43 pm
Location: Tasmania
equipment: Five Star Distilling 6" neutraliser with
100L boiler

Re: Aeration

Postby TheMechwarrior » Tue Jul 22, 2014 12:20 pm

I just picked up an ACO-008 air pump and 4 x 2 micron diffusers.
Time to start working some 1/4" tube now.
TheMechwarrior
 
Posts: 1006
Joined: Mon Dec 05, 2011 1:43 pm
Location: Tasmania
equipment: Five Star Distilling 6" neutraliser with
100L boiler

Re: Aeration

Postby Marbled » Sat Mar 21, 2015 3:19 pm

Something else to try.. More cash out.
Cheers guys
Marbled
 
Posts: 138
Joined: Mon Apr 14, 2014 5:44 pm
Location: Norfabrissey, Qld
equipment: Bog standard T500, which is what got me into this, without it I wouldn't have bothered.

Re: Aeration

Postby xcvator » Thu Jan 07, 2016 5:47 pm

Just wondering who is using this method now and are the results worth the effort, not that there is much effort, which I like coz I'm a lazy old bastard.
xcvator
 
Posts: 172
Joined: Fri Aug 21, 2015 12:51 pm
Location: Mornington Peninsula
equipment: 2" MacBoka
2" Copper Pot still Head
50 Litre keg on a 16000 watt 4 ring gas burner

Re: Aeration

Postby the Doctor » Sat Jan 09, 2016 1:03 pm

xcvator wrote:Just wondering who is using this method now and are the results worth the effort, not that there is much effort, which I like coz I'm a lazy old bastard.

I have been distilling for thirty years, over that time i have heard every BS theory on how to age spirits....and most are exactly that B.S..... Aeration is one of the few inexpensive ways to expedite ageing that works.... We use it in the daily manufacture of our spirits. Aeration is the single biggest impact you can have to the ageing process beyond good oak...but there is a cost ...the angels share is greater...but a small price to pay.
Doc
the Doctor
 
Posts: 612
Joined: Mon May 06, 2013 8:14 pm
equipment: 6 plate bubble cap, grain brewery

Re: Aeration

Postby xcvator » Mon Jan 11, 2016 6:47 pm

the Doctor wrote:
xcvator wrote:Just wondering who is using this method now and are the results worth the effort, not that there is much effort, which I like coz I'm a lazy old bastard.

I have been distilling for thirty years, over that time i have heard every BS theory on how to age spirits....and most are exactly that B.S..... Aeration is one of the few inexpensive ways to expedite ageing that works.... We use it in the daily manufacture of our spirits. Aeration is the single biggest impact you can have to the ageing process beyond good oak...but there is a cost ...the angels share is greater...but a small price to pay.
Doc


Thanks for that Doc, really appreciate any help I can get.
Now one thing concerns me with using aeration is what is the optimum rate at which to apply the air. Too much do you just get a high evaporation rate with no gain and too little is just a waste of time.

So on a per litre of spirit basis what sort of air flow rate do you recommend, say 2 , 4 or even 10 litres per minute and at what abv do you get the best results ?

Sorry for what would appear to be rushing into the ageing process but at my age I don't have time on my side, no sticking some spirit into a barrel and waiting 2 or 3 years to see what comes out and then starting over, I want to drink my hootch not leave it for somebody else :pray:
xcvator
 
Posts: 172
Joined: Fri Aug 21, 2015 12:51 pm
Location: Mornington Peninsula
equipment: 2" MacBoka
2" Copper Pot still Head
50 Litre keg on a 16000 watt 4 ring gas burner

Re: Aeration

Postby the Doctor » Mon Jan 11, 2016 7:41 pm

Xcvator in answer to your question re volume of air per minute.... I do not know the actual volume but we simply let the volume be determined by the use of .5 micron diffusers...these are self regulating due to the size of the pores.... they make a very gentle constant flow of miniature bubbles.... this is a gentle process of really soft small bubbles ..if you get my drift...not at all violent... we use one air line per 100 litres. I hope that clarifies it.
Doc
the Doctor
 
Posts: 612
Joined: Mon May 06, 2013 8:14 pm
equipment: 6 plate bubble cap, grain brewery

Re: Aeration

Postby xcvator » Mon Jan 11, 2016 8:05 pm

:handgestures-thumbupleft: :handgestures-thumbupleft:
Thanks Doc, I know what I'm going to be doing tomorrow afternoon :-D :-D
xcvator
 
Posts: 172
Joined: Fri Aug 21, 2015 12:51 pm
Location: Mornington Peninsula
equipment: 2" MacBoka
2" Copper Pot still Head
50 Litre keg on a 16000 watt 4 ring gas burner

Re: Aeration

Postby 1 2many » Wed Jan 13, 2016 8:44 pm

xcvator wrote::handgestures-thumbupleft: :handgestures-thumbupleft:
Thanks Doc, I know what I'm going to be doing tomorrow afternoon :-D :-D


Do yourself a favour and put an inline air filter before the airstone or you can guarantee it will blockup fairly quick. :handgestures-thumbupleft:
1 2many
Site Donor
 
Posts: 4212
Joined: Sun Jan 27, 2013 6:08 am
Location: Where the sun shines
equipment: Portable A.G brewery ,#001 5 STAR blockhead 4" Modular 4 plate SSG with,6"inline thumper, 2.5" 9 tube shotgun, packed section, Boiler 50 ltr inverted keg 4"still mount, 2.4 Kw FSD elements 1"drain.

Re: Aeration

Postby rumsponge » Tue Jan 19, 2016 8:10 am

Great thread,
I was wondering,.. if the purpose of aeration is simply to increase circulation, has anyone tried to use a magnetic stirr bar/stirrer setup instead ? One should be able to do this in a closed vessel, so I assume the angles share will be lower. Or is there more to aeration than just circulation?
rumsponge
 
Posts: 270
Joined: Tue Dec 29, 2015 11:10 pm
Location: SE QLD
equipment: FSD 4" Neutralizer, 50L keg boiler with 2x2.4kW elements, 60L and 200L fermenters

Re: Aeration

Postby the Doctor » Tue Jan 19, 2016 10:59 am

rumsponge wrote:Great thread,
I was wondering,.. if the purpose of aeration is simply to increase circulation, has anyone tried to use a magnetic stirr bar/stirrer setup instead ? One should be able to do this in a closed vessel, so I assume the angles share will be lower. Or is there more to aeration than just circulation?

I believe that most of the work is done by the gentle agitation caused by the bubbles rising through the spirit...there may be a bit of oxidation involved but I believe that to be secondary.... A stir bar should work. But I have never tried it.
Doc
the Doctor
 
Posts: 612
Joined: Mon May 06, 2013 8:14 pm
equipment: 6 plate bubble cap, grain brewery

Re: Aeration

Postby bluc » Thu Jan 21, 2016 1:53 pm

Sounds interesting doc may just have to build a stirer and give it a go :handgestures-thumbupleft:
bluc
 
Posts: 7635
Joined: Tue Apr 14, 2015 5:47 pm
Location: sunshine coast
equipment: 2" pot with 2" shotty 400mm long 5x 1/2" on a t500 boiler.
50l keg boiler 4" still mount 4" sight glass 1" drain..
4 plate 4" bubbler, 600mm packed section

Re: Aeration

Postby xcvator » Sat Jan 23, 2016 11:18 am

I got my pump ok and made up some copper tube aerators , seems to running ok atm
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
xcvator
 
Posts: 172
Joined: Fri Aug 21, 2015 12:51 pm
Location: Mornington Peninsula
equipment: 2" MacBoka
2" Copper Pot still Head
50 Litre keg on a 16000 watt 4 ring gas burner

Re: Aeration

Postby bluc » Tue Jan 26, 2016 7:57 pm

xcvator wrote:I got my pump ok and made up some copper tube aerators , seems to running ok atm

How are you finding it how long has it been running and are you noticing a quickning of the process? Got my stirrer made just waiting for my stir bar to turn up...
bluc
 
Posts: 7635
Joined: Tue Apr 14, 2015 5:47 pm
Location: sunshine coast
equipment: 2" pot with 2" shotty 400mm long 5x 1/2" on a t500 boiler.
50l keg boiler 4" still mount 4" sight glass 1" drain..
4 plate 4" bubbler, 600mm packed section

Re: Aeration

Postby xcvator » Wed Jan 27, 2016 6:48 pm

As it's only been running for a week it's a bit hard to tell. The jar on the right is my Drambuie and it's has made a huge difference there, and not for the best, it seems to have lost quite a bit of the herbs and spices taste so that's been taken off the aeration atm. 2nd from the right is tpw with some raisins and a french oak domino that was put down on the 28/12/15, it's drinkable now but I expect it to have a large change over the next week or so. 3rd jar is "still spirits single malt whisky " now that 1 should show a pretty dramatic change over a couple of weeks, and the last 1 on the extreme left is double distilled wheat bix whisky down for 1 week with 1 american oak domino, so nfi what that should taste like. My stoppers are just paper towel rolled up very tightly, cheap but effective, like me :-D
xcvator
 
Posts: 172
Joined: Fri Aug 21, 2015 12:51 pm
Location: Mornington Peninsula
equipment: 2" MacBoka
2" Copper Pot still Head
50 Litre keg on a 16000 watt 4 ring gas burner

PreviousNext

Return to Oaking and Aging



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

x