Help Building New Still

[mrjones]

Hello,
I've been using a reflux still for about 4 years and every time I run it I think there must be a better way, I am going to purchase a 120L stainless pot for my BIAB Beer rig and am toying with the idea of making a reflux column and down the track pot still head also to do bigger runs less often and on gas burners so hopefully it'll be quicker, and also I want to fill a wine barrel with a whiskey and can't think of how painful that would be with a 25L still

Now I have been reading heaps and understand the ins and outs and have seen a few designs but a lot of the info I read is contradictory as one persons views are not necessarily the views of others,

this is what I am thinking a 75mm or 100mm wide column of about 1.5m high, I would go higher but I don't want it sticking through the roof of the shed and a condenser hanging off the side similar setup to my essencia one but way bigger, so how much and what type of packing would you run in the column and how big should the condenser coil be, also my basic dimensions will they work?

Now to make the run faster does having a wider column help or is it relative to the height of the column as if I am doing a 100L run its going to take some time so I want the best way off of best quality against fastest time as I don't want to spend 10 hours in the shed running a brew, what's everyone's thoughts on the best way to achieve this?

Cheers
Hamish

[blond.chap]

Hey mate,

First thing is, if you want to make whisky, you won't be wanting a packed column. Better with a plated reflux column like those here: http://www.aussiedistiller.com.au/viewforum.php?f=36.
If you want to make neutral, build a packed column. If you want to do both, build a packed section to fit on top of your plated column (below the reflux condenser).

The way to think about speed of operation is:
- The element power or burner heat dictates how fast the spirit can be produced
- The reflux and product condensers need to be sized to handle the element power
- The diameter of the column needs to be big enough to prevent flooding
- The number of plates (or height of packing) dictates how pure you can make the spirit

As a starting point, the following design suits a 2.4kW element well to make whisky or rum:
- 50L boiler
- 4 plates, 100mm diameter column
- 50 mm high, 75mm wide reflux condenser
- 300mm long, 50mm product condenser

This will produce 2-3L of >90% abv spirit, taking roughly 2-3 hours run time. With a 400mm long packed section on top of the plates, you can make that more like 95% abv spirit.

So if you have the same design, but with a 100L boiler, it'll take you 5 or 6 hours to run (not including setup or clean up). If you want to have it run faster, you'll need more boiler power, a wider column, more plates (or higher packing) and possibly bigger condensers.

[mrjones]

I was thinking of making a reflux column and also a non reflux column for the whiskey, but I like your idea of having a removable section with packing thanks for mentioning that, in fact the more I think the more brilliant it sounds, two extra fittings and it's done.

The burner I have is a 23 tip Mongolian on a high pressure regulator kind of goes like a jet engine its 92000 btu, what ever that equates to in heat, I currently use a 60 litre pot for the beers and its way to powerful for that so thought it'd be well suited for the 100L mark, the reason I was thinking speed with a wider column was my brew pot at the moment is short and wide and the boil off is quite high so my guess on that assumption is possibly correct?

Also the faster you go do you drop quality of the finished spirit as I don't really want to make rubbish spirit?

cheers

[SBB]

I think you need to do a fair bit of looking before you leap, or your just going to waste time and money.

runs less often and on gas burners so hopefully it'll be quicker

Also the faster you go do you drop quality of the finished spirit as I don't really want to make rubbish spirit?

More heat will not help, A still can only produce good quality spirit as quick as its size and performance capabilities dictate. Sure you can run it flat out but what you have to drink wont be great.
Column Diameter is the main thing with Pot stills...or most stills in general , bigger diameter equals faster output.

[blond.chap]

Yep you're correct about being a wider column to go faster, not because it speeds up the process exactly, just that if it's to thin for the power thrown at it, it'll flood.

As long as you can adjust the Mongolian burner with some degree of accuracy then that'll operate fine. I've never used gas though, too nervous about leaks.

You'll want to set the gas flow to get full reflux without flooding or entrainment (when liquid is getting blown off the plates) after that, just leave the gas constant. Then you control the product flow rate by reducing coolant flow to the reflux condenser. And yes, if you take off to fast you'll get a lower quality product, but that's more of am operating issue than a design one.

It's more like, if you run it too fast for the given column width and power then you get dodgy product.

[APR]

The burner I have is a 23 tip Mongolian on a high pressure regulator kind of goes like a jet engine its 92000 btu, what ever that equates to in heat,
cheers

Hi Hamish, That is serious heat energy you have there. 92,000 BTU is equivalent to approx 27,000 watt or 27 Kilowatt.

[mrjones]

I am going to try an draw up some plans, going by the theory of 20 to 25 to 1 height vs. width so thinking 75mm width by 1500mm high, going to use a couple of dairy fittings to add a removable reflux, how long should the reflux unit be as that is one thing I just cant seem to find anything reliable on at all and can see that being a massive issue if I just guess
will try and draw it up this week and see what everyone thinks, would just hate to build something that was going to be a disaster.
Cheers

[blond.chap]

What do you mean by "the reflux unit"?

Reflux is the action of vapour from the boiler being condensed and running back down the column. My first post has some starting off points for dimensions for the reflux condenser if that's what you're talking about.

[MacStill]

here's a VM I built ages ago, the liebig condenser is used on the pot head for stripping/pot stilling as well

IMG_0954.JPG

and here's a couple 3" VM/POT combo I built for others

vm123.jpg

Just to give you some ideas as this sounds where you're headed.

... and here's some crazy shit a few of us got up to before stainless became the rage :music-deathmetal:

:teasing-tease:

[mrjones]

oops sorry I read that but for some reason it didn't register,
reflux unit being reflux condenser, never need to know the correct terms as the wife never listened and the dog didn't really seem to care, I've never been to savvy on the terminology
Will get to drawing some design ideas,
cheers

[mrjones]

Man that's some nice looking gear, I shall be studying those pictures with envy

[Urrazeb]

... and here's some crazy shit a few of us got up to before stainless became the rage :music-deathmetal:

:teasing-tease:

I can see my old pot still :smile: felt like I was bringing a sausage to a sword fight when we started loading the bench up :laughing-rolling: :laughing-rolling:

Sorry for the off topic.. as you were :handgestures-thumbupleft: